148 – Meet the Mad Soyentist with Julie Skaggs of Mad Soyentist Candles

You're listening to gift biz on rapt episode 148,

we are truly a family business and it started by two

science teachers.

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Your gift biz.

Here is your host gift biz gal,

Sue Mon height.

There it Sue.

And thank you for joining me again on the gift biz

on wrapped podcast today,

I have the pleasure of introducing you to Julie Scags of

a mad scientist.

when the soil scientist,

Derek, and his then nine-year-old daughter,

Aaron were looking for a craft project to work on together.

They settled on making candles,

starting with a kit from hobby lobby.

They soon found that they really enjoyed making candles and loved

discovering and creating new sense.

Being a high school science teacher,

the scientist then researched types of soy wax,

optimal WIC thickness sense scent throws,

and the experimenting began encouraged by the early response.

They decided it was time to start marketing their product.

The lab of soy stint,

Julie, a middle school science teacher developed the name and labels.

Julie also started labeling jars,

wicks, creating an inventory and selecting their favorite sense.

hopping today.

The mad scientist is a true family business.

The three work together to create a product customers love.

And this is exactly what happens when you get two science

teachers together with a creative daughter and voila accompany forms.

Welcome to the show,

Julie. Hi,

thanks for having me.

My first question is so apropos.

I have to say because all of the listeners are creative

types like to have you describe yourself in a different way,

and that is through a motivational candle.

I'm sure you have no association with those whatsoever.

I'm actually glad I listened to a couple of your other

podcasts. Cause I thought maybe you had made that up just

for me.

That's funny.

Hey, that could be a good spin.

You never know.

So if you were to share what your ideal motivational candle

would be,

what color is it and what would be the quote on

your candle?

So I gave it just a lot of thought and the

glib easy answer would be well,

it's one of my candles,

of course,

but the more I started thinking about it,

that really is appropriate for us.

I think that the jar containing it is like our family.

It's holding us all together.

And our candles all are Just the plain soy color.

So there's nothing to get in the way of what's going

on there.

So it's pure,

it's pure.

And that's what we strive to be.

We want our candles to be pure.

We want nothing to get in our way of where we

can go with this.

Beautiful. And what would be the quote on the candle?

This is an old one that I found many,

many years ago,

and I never thought about applying that to this situation until

recently. It's you must try to generate happiness within yourself.

If you aren't happy in one place,

chances are you won't be happy any place.

And that's from Chicago Cubs,

legend, Ernie banks.

I love it.

Yeah, because you really have to,

it's kind of like in the airplane,

when they say with the oxygen mask,

you have to put it on yourself first,

before you can help others.

Exactly. So you have to be happy internally first to be

able to spread and grow and get bigger.

Yeah, exactly.

That's where this came from Derek and I were both in

a low spot when this project started for us.

So finding our own happiness and being able to share it

again was amazing for us.

Interesting. So this actually came out of more of a challenging

time, I guess it sounds like it did.

Can you share some of that with us?

Sure. It was very early in our relationship and we had

both just gone through divorces and it really came from Erin

wanting to reconnect with her dad and do some bonding after

that time in their life.

So she just wanted to spend an afternoon with her dad

and that's where this really all came from.

And then as we first experimented and tried with those first

candles that were not very pretty and shouldn't have ever left

the house,

he started developing more and more.

And then we started giving them as gifts and seeing other

people be happy,

made us happy in return.

Wonderful. And what separates your product from others?

What gives people that reaction?

Do you find That's a tough one.

I think what really draws people in for lack of a

better word is our story.

The catch that we are truly a family business and it

started by two science teachers.

We've experimented with putting our candles in different retail areas and

things like that.

And we found the places that were most successful are either

places where we're there to share our story or places where

we have a very motivated shop owner who wants to tell

and is excited about our product.

If you just set it on the shelf,

it kind of blends in and looks like any other candle

out there.

But once you get drawn in and you hear about our

family and how we started,

they're willing to give us a chance and then they absolutely

fall in love with the product.

Wonderful. Well,

I want to get into some of this because I think

a lot of our listeners might be sitting out there saying,

okay, well,

that sounds good,

but what do you do to actually get started?

How do you go from a little box that you buy

in hobby lobby to actually at some point and not very

long thereafter,

five months or so have a business going.

So let's dive in a little bit more to how this

started. So was the afternoon,

was it a snowy Chicago afternoon?

You got it.

Of course it was.

I love it.

Just after winter break.

It was sometime in January.

I'm guessing probably weren't Luther King weekend.

If I remember right.

And they just had the time.

So they went and did this and I have to tell

you those first candles were awful,

but that's right.

Of course,

picture the worst one that you've ever bought in the store

and then make it 10 times worse.

It didn't look pretty.

It didn't smell good.

And we knew that that wasn't going to be very much

fun. I think we burned those first few and then just

throw them away,

tried to forget about them.

And Derek is a perfectionist.

So as soon as he saw that he didn't like what

they had created and that this was still just a hobby

phase. We weren't supposed to go anywhere with this.

He was immediately researching and finding out what would be better.

Why did that wax not give them the look that they

wanted? How could you make it smell better?

How could you get the scent to throw farther in a

room and fill up the whole house?

So he just kind of started playing.

It sounds like instead of doing this project as a fun

thing for he and Erin to enjoy for the afternoon and

then not seeing a good result,

instead of just throwing the whole thing to the side,

there must have been something about the process that they enjoyed

that. Then he had to go and perfect to get a

result that they liked.

Exactly. And that's also the science brain that he has.

He's not going to be satisfied with something that's not done

well. And he wants to find that science to make it

better. Got it.

So instead of switching,

just to another hobby,

cause that was the other option,

right. You decided to narrow in on candles,

which is one of my personal favorites,

which is what attracted me to your booth.

I saw you just a month or so ago.

Right? Right.

I love your display.

And we're going to get into that a little bit later

too. Okay.

So he starts researching how to do this and it's still

just a hobby now.

He wants to perfect it because that's what scientists do I

guess. And if you ask him today,

it's still just a hobby.

Oh it is?

Yes. We don't have a business.

We have a hobby.

Okay. Got it.

Well, we'll get to that later because that's one of those

struggles that we go through.

Right. Okay.

We'll call that a business hobby.

How about that for now?

Perfect. Okay.

So we're still in the creation of the business stage.

And so he's experimenting and working with the product and testing

and is Aaron enjoying that process then right now,

too, She's loving it.

Erin is as many young people,

very motivated by money.

So she's already got dollar signs going on.

So He was already thinking business at the time.

Oh, she is for sure.

One of the first places that we set up,

any kind of display was in the high school guidance office

here at the local high school where not only is Derek

teaching there,

but Aaron's mom works there also.

So they've got a good in with the school.

And Erin started setting up two,

three candles at a time just to let the secretaries and

things see them and she'd come home with that little $5

bill in her hand and be so excited.

And she thinks at point at nine years old that every

penny that we come and bring in is profit.

And she's just ready to take over the world.

Of course.

And why not exactly to see that kind of affirmation,

that something that you've made is something that other people would

want is so exciting,

especially at that young age.

Sure. Help her along.

We wanted to build on that excitement.

And so we kept going.

So that was the response that you were getting,

it was from the high school that made you think,

okay, well now maybe we should see what would happen if

we put a little more professionalism in terms of business behind

this From the high school,

from giving the candles as gifts over the course of those

first few months,

you know,

we had mother's day right in there.

So we were able to keep both of our moms and

aunts and things like that.

The guests,

I also carried the candles with me when I was out.

I had another small business at the time where I was

going out and doing either in-home shows or vendor events and

things like that.

And I started carrying a few of the candles along and

that's when things really started to get interesting.

Oh, okay.

So at that point,

let's back up a little bit at that point,

you already had the name you'd already made the labels.

All of that.

Yeah. Some of it kind of came off Right together in

there. I knew that I wanted something to do with soy

in the name and I wasn't sure how we were going

to play that off.

We also experimented with using a variety of initials,

Derrick and Erin being the primary people involved in it.

At the time we tried variations with their names and initials

and just none of it was working.

I honestly,

to this day,

don't know where it came from,

but mad scientist just popped into my head and it was

absolutely perfect.

It is perfect.

So perfect.

I wish I could say there was a lot of thought

that went into it and I thought it was so creative

and clever.

No, it just kind of popped into my head one day

and our family loves a good pun.

Oh, it worked.

Absolutely. And you get it right away.

Yeah. One thing I've noticed as we've started expanding and going

out and doing shows is it catches people's eye.

They see our sign that says mad scientist,

and they might not care about candles at all,

but they look and they laugh and they chuckle.

And that again is bringing that happiness.

That's a good point in terms of the response to a

name. And I've heard often Julie,

that the idea of what the name should be just happens.

It just comes up when you're least expecting it when you

focus and you really are trying to land it and all

those brainstorming sessions,

sometimes that's not where it happens.

It just comes out of the blue.

All of a sudden,

just magically appears.

And that's exactly how it was for us.

So you had the name,

we had the name.

What did you do about forming a logo and labels?

Once we had the name,

we knew that science had to be a part of whatever

we did.

I mean,

we're pretty big nerds around here.

So the Erlenmeyer flask that's featured on our logo just kind

of came and then fitting the words inside of it.

And around it were just an easy way for it to

fit onto the jars we were using.

We knew early on that we wanted to use traditional canning

jars and the logo that we created just fit perfectly within

that circle.

We've carried that science theme out within our display.

There are times that we'll carry an Erlenmeyer flask with us

and have dry ice going in it.

So it looks like it's bubbling.

Oh, that's cute.

Just a side note.

Cause I know I'll forget it later,

even though I'm taking some notes over here,

but do you have any issues with having dry ice at

any shows?

Are there ever restrictions?

Nobody has ever said anything.

We've only done it twice now.

Oh, you should do it every time We should.

But we find out it's kind of hard to maintain.

We're pumping new ice into that flask every five minutes or

so. Oh,

when we're into one of these really busy shows,

it just doesn't pay off.

Right. But you know,

what would be interesting is if you tried it and maybe

it's not every five minutes,

maybe once an hour,

you do the dry ice show or something,

but it'd be interesting to see if sales change.

I would love to do that.

I'm a person who's always tracking our sales and very competitive

with myself.

Oh, this is how much we did last year at this

event. What can we do this year?

And Derek's just laid back and he's like,

Oh, it's fun.

I, it doesn't matter.

I just like the diocese.

Well, he can be one to stoke the dry ice then.

Exactly. I'd love to hear if you ever do that,

what you find You take a show year over year.

So it's the same location.

Pretty much the same type of people who are coming to

a show and then analyze what happens.

That'd be super interesting.

One thing that we have found in doing this is there

are several shows now we've done three times,

I think is the most we've done any one given show.

There's no way to predict.

Well, cause you've also got the weather aspect,

Right. And it is so up and down,

I'll look at our sales from the previous year and say,

Oh, we sold so many of the cinnamon candle.

We need to have cinnamon just coming out of our ears

and we'll sell to cinnamon the next year.

You can't predict what people are going to go for it.

Interesting. But then do you also just look at overall volume?

Oh, absolutely.

And is that pretty stable or growing?

It's growing for sure.

So that's not as unpredictable.

It's just in terms of which sense are the most popular.

Correct. And with the huge number of scents we have,

I've all.

But given up,

trying to predict,

I just want to make sure we're well-stocked on everything at

this point because I never know which one's going to be

our next big thing.

Right. Interesting.

Okay. So labels,

how did you go about finding someone to make your labels?

Who's doing your labels.

Anything you want to share on that?

I make them all,

Oh, you're hand making the label.

We're hand-making everything.

Julie, you have a million products.

Yes we do.

So when we first started out,

we noticed that there was a label maker that had that

perfect circle size for canning labels.

They had an online template.

So you could buy their sticker labels,

make your design in their computer software and print them out

at home.

Well, we wanted a two-sided label instead of just having a

sticker on the top of the jar.

So we abandoned using their sticker labels and we're using craft

paper that I purchased.

There's just the plain Brown card stock.

I print everything on my home,

computer down here in the basement.

And then we have a giant hole punch and I sit

and punch them all out while I'm watching TV at night.

Well, that gives You a good reason to watch TV.

I'd say It does.

I like to have my hands busy while I'm watching TV.

So that's perfect.

We applied that same template to our business card then.

So our business cards are very non-traditional,

they're the same round as the top of our labels.

So they're not going to get lost in your wallet with

all the other business cards.

That's right.

I have one sitting right here and carrying out that science

theme when we're at a show,

those business cards sit in a little Petri dish on our

table. So we're keeping true to that science and I love

of What you just said there,

because everything is falling in line with the same theme.

I call it the vibe of the business or the vibe

of the brand.

You're sticking with the science,

through your imagery,

through actually the development of the company and your booth display.

That's something that we knew very early on.

We wanted to hone into our nerdiness and kind of pay

tribute to it.

And you say it with conviction and pride.

Absolutely. We wouldn't be where we are today.

Without that.

I mean,

you call it nerdiness.

I think it's cool.

Oh, thank you.

All right.

So We're referencing a little bit earlier that there was a

challenging moment Get into that.

So I think for us,

our biggest challenges are two-fold time and a common vision.

Time is just difficult because we are both working.

Full-time still,

Derek is teaching still.

I've moved out of the classroom and into administration.

So I'm an elementary school principal now.

Oh, congratulations.

Well, thank you either.

One of those takes an ungodly amount of time as many

people know.

And then you throw in the fact that our busiest season

for candles is our busiest season at school.

Also those months of September,

October, November are crazy at school.

And then you throw in the fact that Aaron's playing volleyball

in those same months.

And I just laid out our September,

And we have a six week stretch of time where we

will do shows every single weekend,

plus two nights a week of volleyball plus whatever commitments the

two of us have at school.

Right? So that becomes a big challenge.

There are late nights and crabby people in this house for

a good three months.

Or do you guys create like a celebration or something when

those three months are over,

like something to look forward to,

like we're going to drive through this.

And then here's our,

Our celebration is pretty much this winter vacation time period where

we do nothing.

There's no big hoopla.

We have kind of gotten the custom of on Sunday night

after a big show.

We'll always have a big steak dinner to reward ourselves,

but there's no big culminating celebration.

Guys, just make sure you're driving through and you love what

you're doing,

even though it's super busy,

you love what you're doing.

It's super busy.

We get super crabby.

We'll be at each other's throat every morning when we're setting

up the display.

But once those doors open and we start having traffic come

through that craft show,

all of that is behind us.

We have forgotten it personally.

And we're just out there having fun with each other and

interacting with the customers And you know,

any tension,

at least when I saw you guys doesn't show at all,

I found you guys near the end of that timeframe that

you were talking about,

right? We were at the holiday.

So I don't know,

second week of December show,

right? So you had had a lot of shows under your

belt already,

but when I approached your booth,

you guys were comfortable fun.

Aaron was there,

which was really fun to see her too.

And true to your word.

You talked the story,

we keep talking about that story.

But before we go onto that common vision,

what's the challenge with the common vision.

I want this to be more and I am very business-minded

and want to look at those marketing aspects and how we

can further promote our business and push further.

Derek has happy to have this as a hobby that in

itself clashes with each other.

And that creates its own little stress in there.

But then when we look at the bigger vision,

I look from the aspect of I'm a woman in my

forties, I'm kind of right in that common demographic that tends

to be drawn to our product.

What would I want in a display?

And I have some retail experience in my background.

So I want to make our display super user-friendly attractive,

draw women into that space and have it more like a

boutique or a shop.

Derek being the guy who wants everything in alphabetical order.

So he can find it easily and just know where things

are at the drop of a hat.

And it doesn't really matter what it looks like to him.

He's just happy if we can get through the shell.

Interesting. And so how do you guys work through some of

these challenges?

Some of the differences I'd love to say,

Oh, we communicate and we talk through it,

but that's not the case.

We get snarky with each other and whatever happens,

happens, the display that you saw,

it was very much a compromise on what we both,

like, you got to see a day where we had those

nice straight lines on the risers with all the candles and

alphabetical order.

But I also had my little table that was featuring certain

sense and decorated and a little bit more cute.

I remember that was over to the right.

Yes. So that's where we are today.

I feel like that's taken a step backwards because I had

him down to one riser at one point and more of

the things featured.

But if that's what it's going to take to make us

happy and have less of that tension in the morning,

I'm okay with it.

I don't have to keep a firm hold on.

What I wanted.

Yeah. It is about compromise.

A lot of businesses will have partners and when you're partners

and you're also boyfriend,

girlfriend or married and a family,

there's that other level because you can't walk away from each

other. Exactly.

It sounds like you're managing.

I mean,

the first thing is recognizing,

Right. We had a really interesting conversation one night this fall

because I get very frustrated that I can't contribute more.

I'm doing the labels,

I'm finding the shows,

but for the longest time he was the one that had

the checkbook and was writing out the registrations.

And he's the one who knows the science behind the candles

business would be nothing without him.

I couldn't pick up and do it.

So I felt like I'm just the errand girl.

And there was a night that I was very frustrated and

I kind of just exploded and let that out.

And he shot back with,

well, I'm just the candle guy and I'm just the heavy

lifter. And neither one of us realized how much we felt

that the other wasn't appreciating what we were contributing and that

we both felt like we were a small part.

Interesting. Yeah.

It never dawned on me that he was feeling like he

wasn't contributing enough because he is the product it's not there

without him.

And he quickly pointed out,

well, without me going out and finding avenues for us to

sell our product,

he would just have a hobby that was building up around

him and he'd have lots of inventory and nowhere to go

with it.

And so what happened after you guys had that realization about

each other's thoughts?

Well, one of the things that came out of it is

we finally got a joint checking account.

So we could both be responsible for business finances and things

like that.

And is it a separate account just for the business?

Yes. Perfect.

Yes. And we joke that was a huge step for us

because in our personal finances,

we both maintain our individual accounts,

even though we've lived together for several years now.

So we joke about the fact that our only joint account

is one for the business,

not for the household,

But regardless of that,

everyone on the personal side can do what works for them.

It's so important to have your own business account.

That's separate from personal,

because that way you don't get yourself into any trouble where

you can't pay the mortgage because you just bought in your

case, a ton of wax,

like you,

weren't thinking about the other numbers,

right? I am such an advocate for that because you also

then know if the business is going to be making money

in the end.

sales because we do,

we have a very much a hobby mindset here.

And as long as we're buying enough for that next fix,

for lack of a better term,

we can get that next box of wax or that next

scent that we want to try out.

We're happy.

Anything extra is just that it's a bonus.

And so this year I actually took the time to track

what we were bringing in.

We've always had a pretty good idea of what's going out

because we look at the statements and things like that.

But once I sat and looked at it,

there was more than I thought I was going to surprise

this year.

Oh, that's good.

That means your pricing well,

right. Wonderful.

I want to point out to our listeners here right now

that one of the things that's so nice about turning your

hobby into a business is you can do it for your

very own reasons like you guys are talking about,

you clearly love your jobs at the school.

Oh, absolutely.

So it's not like you're running away from anything you're layering

on your life.

Something else that's fulfilling.

And to your point,

I think you mentioned earlier,

the reason that you got into it initially was the relationships

between Derek and Aaron and you as well.

And this is something that you guys can do as a

family. Think about it.

Erin being younger than still young.

Now she's probably in middle school.

She's a freshman in high school this year.

Okay. Only have a few years with those type of busy

lifestyles. We're This year,

she's 14 and far too cool for a family business.

Now. So the day you saw her,

she was doing some great acting,

but she was really unhappy with us for dragging her along.

But we point out to her that a,

this was your idea.

You got us into this,

you're going to come along.

And B you want certain things in life.

And this is how we're supporting those right now.

She wants to play club volleyball.

And without this,

that might be out of our reach.

So this little extra income is helping provide for those extras

in life that we want.

And she's getting some business education and experience too,

which maybe not right now,

she doesn't understand the advantage of that,

but as she moves forward,

she will.

So you're the point here being people open businesses for lots

of different reasons.

It isn't only just to make money.

And if it is only to make money,

when you have challenges and struggles,

you'll fall because you don't have a deep enough reason inside.

And Julie,

I mean,

you never know what's going to happen as you move forward.

There may be a time when you decide you're done with

school and you want to grow this bigger or Julie's away

at college and you have more time on your hands to

devote to grow it.

Who knows Derek might even feel that way.

Right? So there's a lot of options I would love if

we could get to that point.

Honestly, there's more of a freedom in it in owning your

own business and having,

I mean,

it's a lot of responsibility having those challenges on your shoulders

day in and day out.

But I like the flexibility of being able to set my

own schedule and be able to come and go more freely.

Absolutely. So you're setting yourself up and you're stable and you

enjoy what you're doing now.

And maybe that's what you're going to do for the next

two or three years.

Nothing says you always have to grow bigger.

Right? It's kind of like,

people are always saying you're not successful unless you're advancing and

growing bigger,

you're successful if you're doing what you want to be doing

at that time.

And that's one of the things that we look at each

other almost every weekend during that busy season and say,

is it worth it?

Because the day that it's not worth it anymore,

we're done.

Yeah. But if it's no longer making us happy,

we'll get rid of everything have and move on Or adjust

or downsize if you decide whatever you steer the ship when

it's your own business.

Exactly. All right.

So let's talk about the story a little bit more.

I do have to say when I came to your booth,

what I felt in the display was very much like a

lab table.

Oh. So it fell in line with the whole science thing.

Like it was the lab table with all of the completed

projects done,

which were all the sense of the candles.

That's my impression when I walked in,

I'm glad you got that impression because that was unintentional.

And I've been thinking in my head,

how can I make it more sciency?

I'll give up my side table of our compromise.

If I can incorporate more science look into.

Yeah. Because a boutique almost doesn't,

unless you're doing the science of the sense of the candles

or something like that.

I almost think depending on what you did with the boutique

kind of clashes with the science,

I really liked that long table to be honest.

And I also liked that everything was the same color.

It was very clean and pure,

like call me.

And that's where we're looking at.

The one tweak we want to make to our display for

2018 is to make those risers black with white lettering instead

of that natural wood coloring,

because that black will really help the candles pop against it

more makes sense.

So that's one of our projects for this winter,

but not this week.

We're on occasion.

Yes you are.

Absolutely. Let's take a break right here for a word from

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So how do you Share your story?

Probably it's just getting out and meeting people and sharing what

we have on Facebook.

We're not actively marketing.

So to speak.

We just talk about what we have with friends and relatives.

And we've had wonderful people happen into our lives like yourself,

sharing our story this way,

our very first experience with getting out there and sharing our

story was back when I was carrying the candles,

along with my other little side business,

I was doing a show here in Maringa,

where we're based.

And I had a woman walk in and start opening all

the candles and smelling them all.

And I had no idea who she was at the time.

And all of a sudden,

she bursts out and says,

why are you not in my shop?

And I'm like,

well, what shop is that?

And turns out she was a local business owner that we

had talked about wanting to reach out to,

and just never had the courage to at that early phase.

And once we started working with her,

she was a huge advocate for us.

And I think,

and I might be exaggerating,

but I feel like every person who walked through the door

of her shop was led over to the section where she

had our candles.

And she told them our,

and told them that Derek works right here at the high

school. And his little girl started this isn't this cute.

And that's really where things started moving for us.

She's has continued to be an advocate for us to this

day. Her shop is long gone,

but she loves to go out and visit other small businesses,

especially those that have a kind of a vintage or rustic

farmhouse feel to them.

And if she walks in and sees that they don't have

candles there,

she's on the phone with me that evening telling me,

you have to go reach out to this person.

She's the nicest shop owner.

She needs your candles.

Oh my gosh.

And are you doing that?

Yeah. Good for you.

We are currently in three stores in the area.

One of them is in Rockford and that is one that

we got directly from the scenario that I just described to

you. Another is in Woodstock and that one is doing business.

Side-by-side at craft shows for two years in a row.

She finally said,

Hey, we opened our own shop your products go great with

ours. How do we buy?

So we've done that.

The third one is very new.

We just delivered her first candles to her,

gosh, around the 10th of December,

even later than that,

the weekend before Christmas.

And she just saw us at a show,

liked the product that I'm very busy right now.

I don't have time to talk your busy,

but I have a salon and boutique,

and I want you in my store.

I'll call you Monday.

And a lot of times we hear that and never hear

back, but sure enough,

that Monday morning she was on the phone with me and

we got things set up.

So she has her first test batch down there in Byron

right now.

Beautiful. So how did you then figure out how you're going

to price your product for the stores?

You laugh Because it's hard for us.

I feel like we already have such a great price point

when we're going out and doing them at shows that when

someone sees us as a show,

that's the same price they want to offer in their store

in order to give that price point.

We're not making much in the first place.

So then when we offer them wholesale pricing,

we're making even less,

right? So really when we're selling to that shop owner,

it's almost a 50,

50 split on the profit that comes out of it.

We took our cost into account and we knew that each

candle took X amount to make.

So we charged them just enough over that to make ourselves

feel comfortable and allow them to still,

in most cases,

almost double what they buy it from us for,

to put in their store so that they're making money too.

Okay. So that's a good format actually.

And then have you ever thought about raising your prices at

the shows We have?

And it's probably something that I hate to say is coming

we've been doing this for four years really consistently now,

and we've never changed a price at all.

So I take that back.

Our last show of the year,

we changed one of our bundle options and opted a little

because we realized that it was killing us.

So that one has changed,

but we like that nice,

easy price point,

the four for 20 deal.

And you just hand over that Krista $20 bill makes it

so easy.

Four for 25.

Isn't bad either.

And that's kind of what we're maybe talking about.

Yeah. But we're starting to realize that we can't just give

it away if we want to do some of the other

things that we have in mind to help us grow,

we'll need a little bit extra to do it.

Yeah, absolutely.

And you should stand proud of that too.

With all that you're doing,

you have custom blend your candles,

smell Delicious.

Thank you.

I don't know if you remember the big bag that I

walked. Oh my gosh.

As did my friend,

those are always the most fun days for us when we

have people in the booth and they're excited and they're Oh

my gosh.

Smell this one.

No, you got to smell this one.

Ooh. Monkey fires.

I don't know if I want to smell that one.

And just the excitement on people's face is why we do

this. Oh,

it is so rewarding.

Isn't it?

I keep joking that I want to hide a camera in

the booth and capture some of those.

You should.

I don't know.

I think people would get mad if all of a sudden

these videos are showing up on our Facebook page.

You'd have to have people know,

right? I'd have to have a,

like a little warning sign or something.

Or if there's a really good response,

then you'd have to get something with them signing approval.

No, if you were going to do that,

but I don't think most people would care.

I hope not.

We had a couple of,

at one of our last shows that I almost asked.

Can I just record you on my phone?

You're go Facebook live for a few minutes.

But again,

it's that fear.

Fear is the one thing that has held us back in

a number of ways.

Well, listen,

next time I see you at a show.

I give my permission.

Oh, fabulous.

But the video might be too long because I want to

smell everything Well,

like you said,

we can always edit.

There you go.

What have you seen at shows?

That would be good advice for people who are doing the

local craft shows.

What have you learned over the years that could help somebody

get farther along,

faster, based on your experience.

You can't be afraid to talk to people.

I walk the show while we're there and I will forever

see vendors sitting behind their table on their phone,

not interacting with customers.

And I'll admit we're guilty of that too.

But we kind of have this unwritten family rule.

That one person always has to be on their feet so

that they're ready.

And we try and make that be Erin as much as

possible because she's a cute little kid Ugly on their feet,

physically, not just sitting.

Right. And it's honestly,

you've got to interact.

That's the biggest thing for me,

those blast show we were at,

we had great neighbors on either side of us that were

willing to interact with Austin,

with other vendors,

but they weren't doing much to draw people into their space.

They talked to people when they came up,

but they didn't approach them.

They didn't initiate the conversation.

They more just answered the questions.

Does that make sense?

Yeah. I think people get uncomfortable on both ends someone who

is the business person,

but then also someone who's looking and just strolling and wanting

to see things.

But I think people get uncomfortable because they think they automatically

have to talk about the product.

Right. It's a fine line.

It's some days I'll just initiate with,

Oh, good morning.

Are you enjoying the show?

Was there anything you're looking for today?

I can help point you in the right direction.

Other days,

I feel like a carnival Barker,

just trying to get people to come in and it's all

about me and the product.

So it's a fine line that you have to walk,

which do you find works better?

I think you have to connect with them as a person

first. You can't start pushing product on someone's throat.

If you know anything about them.

I agree.

I think that's the point I was trying to see if

you would agree with,

is it doesn't have to be about your booth and your

product. It's just an interaction so that they feel comfortable coming

in and looking around and then you're not stalking them either.

Right? If someone wants to smell every single candle,

let them do it themselves.

Oh, absolutely.

Then not talking all the time,

either with them,

but knowing that you're there and available.

And I think that's the other thing that we've noticed for

us personally,

is because everything on our display,

it looks exactly the same.

People can be quick to walk by.

They think they know what it is and they don't take

the time to walk in and see.

But once you get one or two people in there smelling

those candles and having fun and laughing,

then all of a sudden people just start flocking and they

all want to see what the excitement's about.

So doing whatever you can to generate that excitement within your

space as well.

Got it.

And then how do you decide which shows to attend?

We originally started out just,

Hey, this is one we heard,

they're still opening.

Let's try it out.

And we were floored.

We had no idea what to expect from a three-day show

in the middle of November.

After that,

we got pretty good at talking to other vendors around us

and finding out what they suggested,

What to expect in terms of what happened.

There was there too Much traffic,

too little traffic.

We were pleasantly surprised by the amount of traffic we're overwhelmed

by people's response to us.

That was our first big show.

Oh, That's really too bad.

Right? I know shocks.

And then we got really excited and thought home,

maybe we should do more of these.

And that's when we started to talking to the people around

us, where do you have success?

What shows should we avoid?

One thing that we found that was important to us,

because we are truly a handmade product,

is that we want to be at shows that feature only

handmade products.

If we go into a show regardless of the size,

that is also letting in the direct sales marketing companies,

we're automatically seeing a different type of traffic that comes through.

And for us in the candle business,

it's hard to go up against some of those big,

I won't say names,

but the big ones that are out there all of the

time and have that brand loyalty behind them.

Right. But I would say because I'm a candle that I

like different versions of all different types of candles.

And I also like to support local and smaller businesses.

So even though I like Yankee candle,

sometimes I love some of the smaller local candles.

And I think that's where we're finding our own niche and

our own brand loyalty.

We've been around long enough.

Now that we have people who come to shows and say,

we're here because you are here.

We wanted to see you.

I'm out of my Oak Moss and Amber candle.

What can I get,

Oh my gosh,

Julie, those stories are,

when you pull out the phone and say,

Hey, can I get just a quick testimonial from you of

this? Would you mind?

And even if they don't want to be on video,

you can at least record it.

You can ask them if it's okay if they use your

face or not,

or just the words,

but, Oh my gosh,

those are golden.

Those in the moment,

ones are the ones that I miss.

I'm really easy.

If someone leaves us positive feedback on Facebook or through our

credit card app,

those I'm quick to share it's those in the moment face

to face ones that I miss.

Yeah. Yeah.

And boy,

you could get,

because now on Facebook too,

on your banner,

you can put videos up there.

Yeah. So you could do just a few videos of people

who, I mean,

a lot of people who would be willing to do that

if they're such a supporter,

come to the show,

cause you're here.

Here's why I love these candles.

Now you have me picturing specific people in my head that

I want to seek out.

Okay, There you go.

There you go.

So in this of course,

gift biz listeners is an idea for you as well when

you're out and about.

And someone is sharing that information and supporting your business so

much, ask them if you can pull out the phone and

just record a quick testimonial,

nothing is better than words from others about your business.

All right,

let's move on to tools for productivity or how you're getting

everything done or just the way you fit everything in,

especially in those three months,

what are any tips or tricks you have for us Right

now? My biggest best friend is probably Google docs because I

can be editing something when I'm on my lunch break at

school and Derek,

you can see it immediately while he's on his break at

his school.

Oh, good point.

Without emailing things back and forth,

we've got that Google account that we both know the password

for. And I can update inventory or shoot him an order

that's come in or things like that during the day.

Or I'm really good at,

Hey, could you deliver this tonight?

But oops,

I forgot the invoice for it.

So I'll make the invoice at school and he'll print it

at home.

Something like that.

Perfect. Cause you can do it on your time and then

he can receive it on his time.

Right. So I think that's the biggest one for us.

My next one needs to be some type of book keeping

software. And that's what I've been researching over break right now.

Oh, So you're looking for a new bookkeeping software,

Right. Because right now we don't have any,

I've got,

just got a spreadsheet in Google that I'm using.

And at the end of each show,

I will record things like how many of each candle we

sold for each cent.

So I can track our best sellers throughout the year.

I've got our show,

total sales in that as well as what it costs for

us to enter that show.

And that's about the extent of bookkeeping that I'm doing right

now. Yeah.

You know,

you're going to find when you land it.

I personally use QuickBooks for both my businesses,

but when you land,

whichever one it's going to be,

you'll find that life is so much easier And I've used

QuickBooks in the past.

So that's where I'm leaning right now.

Yeah. I've used them always,

but I know there's other options out there too.

Right? What are you using?

Just curious.

What are you using to capture?

Do you take credit cards,

right? We do.

We use square.

You use square.

Okay. When we first started out,

we were using the payment processor through QuickBooks,

the Intuit payment and at a show talking to another vendor,

they had just started using square.

We started comparing rates and I moved to that the next

weekend. What advice do you have for somebody who's listening and

thinking? Ah,

you know,

I have a craft that,

this sounds interesting what Julie and Derek are doing here.

I could possibly do myself too.

What would be your advice and the first steps that they

should take to get stuck?

Make sure you love what you do first of all,

because you're going to be doing it a lot.

Yeah. So that's where I would start.

If you were really looking at this and intending to start

a business,

which is not where we were,

so this is not what we did,

but I would say go out there and go to those

craft fairs and see what's out there.

Is there a market for what you're doing is that market

over saturated?

There are some craft fairs we go to and every other

booth is the painted farmhouse signs that are popular right now.

Well, that's great if that's an,

a market that can support that,

but not all markets well.

So I think just finding out and then starting small,

go to those craft fairs at your local school or the

church basement or all of those kinds of things.

Don't feel like you have to commit to the $200 for

a weekend entry fees when there's a perfectly good show,

just down the road for $50.

I think that's really smart because you're also able to test

a lot of things.

You're able to test receptivity to what your product is.

You're also able to test your price point,

right? And just your services like you might go and realize,

Oh my gosh,

I don't even have any bags to put my product in

when someone makes a sale like such obvious things.

Exactly. But it's those little things that all add up and

you can do it in a stress free situation when you're

not committing a lot of dollars.

And you're also doing a smaller venue to start.

I think that's excellent advice.

We were kind of lucky in that.

I had some of those little kinks worked out before we

started with the candles because of my previous life with a

business about one thing that I found there is you have

to have like a little survival kit that you take on

the road with you.

Not just the things specifically business-related,

but take that Advil with you.

Cause you know,

there's going to be a day with a headache,

extra safety pins or tape or string,

all of those little things just in like a little tote

that you can carry along because inevitably if you don't need

it, your neighbor will need it.

And it's just nice to have all of those little things

right there,

handy as you're out on the road.

Oh, that's a great point.

And if you're needing something that you don't have,

make yourself a note and then throw it in your little

tote and then it's already there for them Next time out.

Exactly. My tote has things like scissors.

I have a pair of pliers in there for some reason.

I can't even think a lighter Tylenol.

Gum is always in there.

And then all the extra business things get thrown on top.

So that's where our square reader gets thrown in the money,

pouch, all of those things.

Really interesting,

good advice.

I never thought of that before Julie,

I'd like to invite you to dare to dream.

I'd like to present you with a virtual gift.

It's a magical box containing unlimited possibilities for your future.

So this is your dream or your goal of almost unreachable

Heights that you would wish to obtain.

Please accept this gift and open it in our presence.

What is inside your box?

So I'm going to dream a big,

there is enough time in that box that I can dedicate

to furthering this business to the point where at least one

of us doesn't have to teach anymore because although we love

that it would be nice to have some of that independence

that I talked about earlier and have the time to devote

solely to this and put back into it.

Perfect. I love that.

And you're marching right down that path right Now.

We're working on it.

If you want to write,

if we want to,

if you want Two and when you want to and whichever

one of you,

it would be so lots of options there for you.

And we have so many ideas about other things we can

do and branch out and how to continue to grow,

but it does come down to that time for us.

Sure. And it doesn't mean it needs to be tomorrow.

It can be three years From now.

So you'll have to keep an eye on us.

Ooh, No,

I'm really super curious.

So I'm thinking we all could keep an eye out if

we watched your Facebook page.

Right. Okay.

And tell the listeners where they can find you on Facebook.

We are@facebook.com,

backslash mad scientist,

Madsen. Perfect.

I love how everything is aligned With you.

Well, thank you.

Having that past experience,

both in retail and owning a small business before that brand

identity is something that I recognized was a failing point in

a previous experience.

So having that and having everything tied together here is very

important to me.

Yeah, for sure.

Well, Julie,

thank you so much.

I appreciate your taking your downtime.

We're winter break to come on and share your story.

Absolutely. It's really been Interesting.

I know you were first thinking,

well, you know,

it's a hobby,

but it's a business,

but it's a hobby,

but it's a business it's perfect for our listeners.

Wonderful. It's absolutely the best you've shared such great information.

Thank you for sharing the story.

We are all going to keep our eye on and may

your candles always burn bright.

Thank you.

So This episode is all wrapped up,

but fortunately,

your gift biz journey continues.

Are you eager to learn more?

Our gift biz gal has a free download just for you.

Head over to gift biz on wrapped.com/twelve

steps to get your copy of the 12 steps to starting

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