123 – Power Up Your People with Matt Holmes of Home & Company

Hi there.

You're listening to gift biz on rapt episode 123.

If we weren't willing to change and adapt to what our

customers wanted,

that we probably,

we wouldn't be in business.

Hi, this is John Lee,

Dumas of entrepreneur on fire,

and you're listening to gifted biz unwrapped,

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If you know what to do to help you with this,

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And now let's move on to the show.

Hi, there it's Sue and welcome to the gift biz unwrapped

podcast, whether you own a brick and mortar shop sell online

or are just getting started,

you'll discover a new insight to gain traction and to grow

your business.

And today I have the pleasure of introducing you to Matt

Holmes, Matt and his wife,

Jennifer started their retail journey about 12 years ago in downtown

Holland, Michigan with a gift and decor store called home and

company. It took a couple of years to get to that

aha moment.

When they realized they were focused on all of the wrong

things. Matt and Jennifer had just opened a second concept store

called tiptoes.

When the recession hit,

they knew they needed to do something to adapt.

Thankfully they put in place some common sense practices recognizing the

importance of their people and trusting their customers.

They not only survive the recession,

but are thriving today.

And I am so excited for myself to hear this whole

story and give biz listeners for you to hear the whole

story too.

Matt, thank you so much for coming on the show.

It's my pleasure,

Sue. Thank you for inviting me to be a guest.

I am happy to be here and excited to share a

bit about our story.

Well, I've got lots of questions for you.

So I like to start off in a little bit of

a different way,

and that is by having you describe yourself through a motivational

candle, we're all creatives here and it just gives us another

look at what you're all about.

So if you were to describe your ideal motivational candle,

what color would it be and what would be the quote

on your candle?

Oh, interesting.

Okay. So,

you know,

the color I'd probably choose is yellow.

And I say that because yellow to me is kind of

one of those bright warm and like cheerful colors.

And it's also a bit of an attention getter.

So I guess for me wearing my marketing hat and kind

of my human resources hat,

I see that as a yellow candle.

And in terms of like an inspirational quote,

mine would be specific to what I do in terms of

the retail business.

And, you know,

forgive me the originator of this quote.

I cannot remember or recall who said this,

but there's a quote that stuck with me over the years

of our retail journey.

And that is that the customer's perception is your reality.

And I think that would be the inspiration that I would

put on that candle.

And so many of the things that I think I'll share

with you about was kind of how that realization that,

how the customer perceived things was actually our reality.

That was part of that aha moment that you alluded to.

Oh, interesting.

Yeah, because we all know our businesses and know our intent

and know what we're trying to project,

but really that means nothing.

If we're not relaying it that way,

it's based on what the customer sees of us.

Absolutely. Really important to remember.

Great quote for us to start off with let's begin at

the beginning.

All right.

So let's take it back 12 years ago.

What prompted you to start thinking about opening a shop in

the first place and I'm making the assumption that it was

always retail?

Yes, correct.

That's a great question.

And it's funny actually,

because it was about 12 years ago to the day I

was recently away at market and my wife was home and

I sent her a text and I said,

happy anniversary,

sweetheart. And it wasn't in reference to our wedding anniversary,

which was before the start of our business journey together.

But it was in reference to our beginning in business.

And I said,

it was 12 years ago tonight that we argued about how

to count the cash drawer,

shared a laugh about that.

And of course there's been many things that have come up

since then that we've had to figure out how to maneuver

it together.

But yeah,

going back 12 years,

we were in a position where I was in real estate

2005 when we were making this decision to get in and

the real estate market had started to slow.

And it was a difficult thing for me to be involved

in, in my wife was actually working as an independent merchandiser,

doing visual displays for some stores in our town and had

experience of growing up in a retail store herself.

She has one sibling,

she has a twin brother,

Jeff, and the two of them growing,

working in their parents' retail store always swore to one another

and their parents that by no means would they ever get

back or be involved in retail.

And of course that's not true for us and nor is

it for her brother.

Who's a retailer up in Trevor city now.

Oh, no kidding.

That's funny.

So anyway,

we had this idea that we wanted to create a store

that was focused on really decorative items for the home.

And we also laugh many times now about how,

if the store looked the way that we wanted it to

look, and if we weren't willing to change and adapt to

what our customers wanted,

that we'd probably we wouldn't be in business.

So anyway,

we started with home and company primarily focused on decor,

decorative accessories and a little bit of gifts.

we opened to knowing that we wanted to treat people well.

And that was about it.

To be honest with you,

What were you looking for in the first retail location when

you were out scoping out locations,

what was important to you at that point?

You know,

it's interesting for us location was important and it's a lesson

having opened a couple of different retail locations that certainly when

you live through you see and realize,

but it's something you can hear over and over.

But location was certainly something that was important to us.

We chose a spot where we started in downtown Holland,

Michigan, which if you're not familiar with our wonderful community,

I mean,

I know you have listeners from all over the place.

We have a great town in a tremendous festival and snow

melt sidewalks.

So in the winter when it snows,

the snow magically disappears.

So there were a lot of things that led us to

say, wow,

this is a great location and a place we want to

be. But of course there was the trade-off of the higher

rent costs and kind of that bigger risk to take on.

But the location was probably the number one factor as I

think back Is your location still there today?

Yes, we are still in the same location that we opened

Homeland company in today.

In that time we did open up that second business tiptoes,

And we opened that on what I would say was like

a B location.

And we did relocate that to bring it into the main

street and downtown a couple of years after opening it.

Interesting. Okay.

So you had one success in one where you wanted to

make a little adjustment.

So if you were to give our listeners who might be

thinking about a brick and mortar,

the three biggest things they should be considering,

if they're looking at going that route,

what would you say?

It's a great question.

So, you know,

the one I just touched on location is important and we've

also in addition to being in a downtown location,

we've sent open a location that isn't in a downtown,

but it's on a busy interchange if you will,

where there's heavy traffic.

And so there's kind of those two thoughts.

Are you in a center like a mall,

a strip center,

a downtown environment where there's traffic built in?

Although I say those first two,

the mall on the strip center with a little bit of

caution, because there's certainly a lot of questionable press and things

happening with some of the anchor tenants on those on the

large mall locations.

But anyway,

location is an important consideration.

And then looking at the lease structure and thinking about what

type of commitment you're willing to get into,

because there's obviously trade offs on both sides,

the longer commitment you sign up front,

the more liable you are for something,

if your business model does not work out in that location.

But of course,

if it turns out to be a good location that can

also set you up to be in a good position.

So location lease and gas or third thing,

I guess,

would just be how willing the landlord,

if you're not in a position to purchase the property,

how willing the landlord is to work with you and to

help you out.

And so I think those three things are pretty critical to

navigate and think through as you're considering a brick and mortar

location. Okay.

When you say work with you do mean like if you

needed to separate yourself from a lease or build out situation.

Yeah. Both being really critical because just like in anything there's

different ownership groups and different opportunities to lease from a variety

of people.

And I think you can get a sense when you're working

with someone,

but it's always good to have things in writing too.

So if there's some clauses that you can put,

in fact,

one of the initial leases that we did for a business

we opened was that we made it contingent on sales.

So the landlord wanted to fill the space and they were

willing to work with us and in doing so we put

together a lease agreement,

which paid them on a percentage of sales.

And so in theory,

when we had a good month,

their rent was higher.

And when we had a poor month of sales,

we paid less than rent.

And so that was a piece of mind for us,

kind of a nice security to know that if we struggled,

then we were going to pay less.

However, over time I went back and renegotiated that lease.

Once we had figured out that the concept we had was

working, because then it started to favor the landlord and I

wanted to of course,

renegotiate, Right.

And it's in the property.

Owner's best interest also to do something creative like this,

because once you get a tenant in,

you want to keep them for as long as you can,

if you're looking from the property owners.

Oh, without a doubt.

Yeah. They want the same thing,

you know,

both parties,

if they truly want the same thing,

you can put together a good agreement because yeah.

It's absolutely way more costly for the owner to go out

and find a new tenant or to do another build out

for someone or market the property.

So yes,

absolutely. So the three things to look at,

or the first three things,

I guess we should say,

Matt's talking about location,

your lease structure,

what you are committing to also,

what's part of that lease in terms of the services that

they include versus what you might have to do such as

snow removal,

electricity, wifi,

all of that type of thing.

And then how willing they are to work with you,

which you have one way to get under that too,

I think is to talk to other people who are leasing

space from that same person.

Yeah. Great point.

Yeah. All right.

So you got into your first shopping,

you were talking already a little bit about how you wanted

to set it up one way and you saw your customers

needed it set up a different way.

Can you give us a little more information on that?

Yeah, Well really what it came down to was kind of

like the policies and the way we conducted ourselves in the

way that we thought about our business.

I think in terms of what your product mix is,

whatever category you're in,

whether it's retail or a home-based business or anything,

you always need to be open to adapt.

And so like our product mix,

we could follow kind of the customer's progression.

And part of that was just analyzing what's selling and what's

not. But when we really,

I think kind of had that aha moment was at about

the same time that we opened our second concept store tiptoes,

which is a children's store in Holland,

Michigan. And if I had had a magic crystal ball or

it could see into the future,

I don't know that that business would exist today because we

actually signed,

speaking of lease agreement,

So we were coming off what felt like a pretty good

holiday season for us at home and company a couple of

years into the business.

And we thought we were ready to expand and try another

concept. And so we signed that lease agreement in December of

And as you know about that time,

I'm sure many of the listeners can understand as well that

had a dramatic impact.

business, which was two years old,

but also on this new business that we opened.

And so frankly,

you know,

really up to our eyes and debt and owing vendors,

lots of money,

having less than anticipated sales and really not having any plans

in place for how to deal with those types of things.

So it was a very challenging time for us.

And the beginning of that,

that we're describing and realizing that what we were doing was

broken. And if we wanted to stay in business,

that we needed to make some serious adjustments.

And that was kind of the beginning of many things to

come. I think that was really a smart thought process for

you guys,

because what you could have said is,

Oh, it's the economy.

This is just what's happening.

Oh, poor us.

Right. But you didn't,

you took control of it and said,

all right,

yes, this is happening.

But this is just one challenge among lots of them that

we'll have as business owners.

And you looked inside of what could you do?

What could you,

as the business be responsible for fixing so that,

you know,

you weren't going to shut her,

That couldn't be more accurate.

And I think that that's one of the most important things.

I spoke with a group of some retail peers recently,

and we were talking about this.

And I think that probably the number one attribute,

at least from my perspective,

the number one thing that a successful entrepreneur business has to

have is that ability to first look in the mirror and

to accept responsibility for everything else that's happening in their business

and around them.

And when we're willing to first address our own faults,

rather than like you said,

point blame at different things that happen.

That's the first step in seeing yourself through any challenge,

in my opinion.

So what did you do you talk about the fact that

you common sense practices is what you're talking about,

but then really turning your eye to your people,

which I think you're talking about is your employees and then

also the customers.

So give us a little more detail of what you were

able to do to survive during that time.

Yeah, absolutely.

I think probably the biggest part of that aha moment was

realizing that we had an impact on the customer's experience in

our store.

And I think up until that point,

we knew that we wanted to treat people well,

that we wanted to be nice to our customers.

And we didn't really expand on that with our staff.

We didn't really talk about what that meant.

We didn't really put it into terms they could understand,

and I don't think we had an unpleasant environment,

but we didn't have a sales focused customer service focused environment.

And so the first thing that we did is we kind

of made a drastic shift and in this,

it was a disruption in our norm.

And so we did through the process,

lose a couple of people and we didn't position it in

a way that it was anything reflective on them.

It was just that we were going to be making some

changes in our business,

and if it didn't fit with who they were,

then they were okay to go.

And I think some of that can be healthy because anytime

you need to make a change,

some people are able to take change and embrace it.

Other people it's just really against their nature and are adverse

to change and struggle with it.

So the biggest thing that we did was we basically looked

at selling as a skill and realized that if we're going

to improve our skills,

we need to practice our skills.

And that was the number one thing that we began to

actually train coach and focus time and energy and effort and

dollars into develop our service staff.

And that was the biggest step forward in the right direction

for us.

I think that's an interesting mentality to have in terms of,

you're just not hiring people to put in hours,

work the floor,

straightened stock,

check customers out,

making an investment in your staff.

Number one makes them feel more valued and is also obviously

doing good things for your business in terms of customer interaction,

all of that.

Plus it's really nice because it's given those associates added skills

that they're going to either use while they're with you or

as they move forward.

Yeah, absolutely.

We know for some of our people,

we're a landing point that some people will come to us

and we've been super blessed and fortunate to have people that

have been our employee for eight or 10 or 11 years

out of the 12 that we've been around.

But we also have a variety of young people and people

that are kind of using this as a stepping point to

the next spot in their career,

as much as I would like to think that every person

I interview's dream job is to come and work for us.

You know,

I know that people have aspirations that probably go beyond retail

a lot of times.

And so,

yeah, that's exactly right.

We love to be able to develop those skills and say

to that person in the interview process and through their training,

that if you invest yourself into what we're trying to do

with you and help you,

you're going to take these skills and be able to apply

them in all sorts of ways in your life ahead.

If we learn how to sell and interact with people and

ask good questions and be attentive in that process,

those are skills that you can use in job interviews and

team meetings with your family and your kids and all throughout

life. Absolutely.

And you've just defined then what the training looked like in

terms of communication and interacting and all of that.

And Matt,

you and I have chatted a little bit when you were

in your summit about how,

you know,

brick and mortar is different than it was even 12 years

ago, really,

you know,

as the internet and online and everything has just exploded certainly

way different than 20 years ago,

having brick and mortar,

one of the biggest things that stand out versus people going

and buying any type of product online is the experience that

you get in the store.

Oh yeah,

absolutely. So when you talk about the skills that that training

did in terms of the communicating,

listening to a customer,

how did that relate?

Like how did the associates change their behaviors when they're talking

to a Great question?

So I think it's one thing to say,

okay, we're going to do this training and we can get

a variety of people into a room and you can go

through an hour training and everybody can get incredibly excited,

you know,

about it.

And you can have these short little interactions,

but without the follow-through,

and without the accountability piece,

things go from real order or a really good to slipping.

And so over time,

we know that if we don't focus on those things,

and it's not part of our regular dialogue,

and we're not doing anything to keep people accountable,

that those things will slip back.

And so for us every day,

each person on our staff is required to basically complete a

short assignment.

So to give you an example of what it looks like

in our store,

we have rotating daily focuses.

We call them and a daily focus might remain the same

for about a week or a shorter period of time,

but for a couple of days,

because not every person works every day,

it's okay to be focused on the same thing for a

couple of days in a row,

I believe two.

And so the daily focus might be that after you've helped

a customer find something that they're on their way up to

the counter at some point in the process that you recommend

show or tell the customer about some other product in the

store. And so that would be an example of how we're

trying to add on.

And we look for value added,

add on so that a per se,

the customer is a gift that we are sure to tell

them that we have gift cards and that we have something

else that may compliment it.

And that would be an example of one daily focus.

And so our staff person,

when they start their shift is required to do a role

play. That's the first part of it.

And the role play is a two or three minute piece

where they get together with another manager or another peer,

and they go through a scenario and it can be the

daily focus,

or it might be a new product that came in,

or it could be anything.

Ideally we want them to focus on the things that they

believe they need practice it.

And so this would be kind of like the practice part.

And when I'm talking to staff and we're setting this up

and we're reinforcing it,

I'm always trying to relate it back to something that makes

sense to the staff person I'm talking to.

So if I know the person is a musician,

for example,

and that they play an instrument like the clarinet,

I might say to that person,

when you're preparing for an event or an orchestra performance,

what do you do?

How much time do you spend practicing your instrument?

How often do you do it?

Why do you do that?

And what I'm trying to do is build the bridge and

help them connect the fact that when they practice their instrument,

they became more confident in their performance,

enhance their skills.

And we're hopefully at the pinnacle of their playing time.

It's also more natural if they've tried it a couple of

times, it's more likely that they're going to be more natural

in front of a customer.

Oh, absolutely.

And we're very Frank about that too.

It's like,

look, and when we hire new people,

I tell them,

it's like,

this might be unnatural or feel kind of uncomfortable for you,

but I'd much rather have you go through those steps with

one of us then with the customer.

And so you're a hundred percent right on there.

And so anyway,

they do the role-play,

they fill out just a quick bit of information about the

role play.

And then throughout the course of the day,

they're accountable for writing three instances in which they did the

daily focus.

And then what the customer's reaction was Interesting.

Then what do you do with that?

So then when they're done with their daily focus slip,

we have a spot where those go and myself or our

sales trainer will pull the slips out and we'll read through

them and we'll just jot back a short note or two

to the staff person.

And so basically what we want to do is show the

person on the,

we're asking to complete this daily focus sheet that we're looking

at it and to give them the feedback or encouragement based

off of what they've read.

This is such a unique approach.

I've never heard of this before,

nor Matt have I heard of a retail shop having a

sales trainer?

Hey, well,

you know,

it's interesting,

it's certainly an investment to get to that point to make

that leap.

But the payback is huge,

not just in customer retention and increase sales,

but what you alluded to earlier too,

is what we have found is when the staff feels competent

and feels equipped and feels successful,

that they frankly enjoy what they're doing more.

And it helps us retain our customer service people as well.

Totally Agree.

That is,

so one question comes to mind,

I'm wondering how you handle this.

Everyone's a little bit different.

Some people will feel very comfortable approaching and doing the ad-on

type thing,

you know,

identifying another product,

just like you were saying,

in your example,

some people are less comfortable with that.

Some people have other types of skills.

Do you try to mold things to each employee or do

you want them to work the system based on whatever that

task the action is for the day,

the daily focus?

Yeah. Great question.

I think I'll kind of answer that in two ways.

So we're always aware,

or we're always attempting to be aware and to communicate with

our staff about where in the store they feel most comfortable

in what product they feel most comfortable selling so that we

have a realization of that.

And when it's busy,

we try to station or position those people into the spots

that make the most sense for them based on that.

But in terms of like the daily focus,

you know,

and the attempts to add on,

we would rather try to do then give the person a

pass on that is reemphasize,

why it's important.

And it was actually someone else in the retail world,

a fellow by the name of Bob Nagan with the whizzbang

training. And I sat in a conference and you just take

little snippets from different people that you hear.

And he had shared this story and it always stuck with

me going back probably like 10 years ago now about a

visit to his eyeglass doctor and the poor experience he ended

up having,

because the eyeglass doctor didn't tell him about all the things

that he might potentially need for his bifocals.

And it ended up resulting in more trips.

And so what we try to help that salesperson understand is

that attempting to add on,

if we look at it in terms of just attempting to

sell the customer something,

because we want to add on to our sales,

that's not the goal.

What we're trying to do is sell the customer something that

they may not otherwise have seen or may not have otherwise

realized, could enhance their purchase.

And so we'll try to work through some kind of real-world

in store examples of what that can look like to help

that person,

rather than just give them a pass on it altogether.

I really appreciate that explanation because I've been in situations where

I'll walk into a store and I'll have something.

And, you know,

I was fully intending on whatever I've found now I'm going

to purchase and someone will come up to me and show

me something.

And clearly they've had some add on training or,

you know,

they've been told to bump their sales or something,

and they are showing me something that we never talked about.

Doesn't relate to the product that I have.

Like it's a total disconnect.

And it's clear that it's for the stores financial gain,

not by gain as a customer Distinction between the two absolutely

Completely. So we've talked about the fact that the experience is

everything and that totally,

you know,

in terms of interacting with your employees and then also with

the customer in mind,

which goes back to your candle quote,

all of that in-store experience is so,

so, so important to brick and mortar right now.

What else are you seeing is helping bring people in the

door? You know,

I really think that we've got to do as brick and

mortar retail.

We have to differentiate ourselves from not just the big box

stores, but the other experiences that customers are choosing between when

they choose to come to us.

And so,

you know,

obviously having a dynamic product mix and having product that the

customer wants is important,

product price,

all those different things.

So having product.

And then I think doing things that while the customer,

and one of my big focuses in terms of marketing and

keeping our business in the top of customers' minds has been

this philosophy of the givers get.

And so doing promotions and things that stand out from what

everybody else is doing and being willing to kind of take

some risks and think outside of the box.

Can you give us an example?

Yeah, absolutely.

I work with a group of retailers that we have stores

spread all over the country.

We're a part of this independent buying group called the Southwest

buying group.

And among member stores,

there's gosh,

maybe like 500 rooftop location.

So it's quite a large network of people sharing and such.

And again,

kind of as a side note,

if you're listening out there and you're not connected with other

people that are doing similar things to what you're trying to

do in your industry,

whatever you are,

a craft or a retail store owner Baker,

or whatever,

do what you can to reach out and make some connections

with other people that are in your profession and outside of

your trade area.

So as a side note,

sorry to jump away from the question too,

but that just kind of popped into my mind.

That's been one of the,

probably most dynamic things that's impacted our business.

So reach out and connect,

but where I'm going with this is to a promotion that

we did successfully now for a couple of years running,

one of the,

like kind of the staple items in our area where it

gets cool in the winter.

Well, frankly,

cold in the winter and is the fleece line leggings.

And so,

you know,

the leggings are very popular now it's kind of the base

to many different tops that ladies are using to wear.

And at our store home and company,

we have a small fashion area.

And so we have been able to negotiate some great pricing

the last few years on these fleece lined leggings and everybody

else bar none in our entire group is going out at

a price.

I believe of like nine 99 on these leggings or seven

99. Perhaps we run specials in the holiday season with these

leggings, not much above our cost at three 99.

And the quality of the legging is phenomenal.

People literally can't believe it when they try it on in

many, many times throughout the season,

we have people that aren't even customers coming into our store

because so-and-so told them about this unbelievable knock your socks off

offer. And everybody in the group thought I was a little

bit crazy for this,

but we still,

I don't know,

eight or nine pair of fleece lined leggings and created an

incredible buzz,

which brought all of these people in multiple times in the

last six weeks leading up to Christmas when Gus what they

had to buy Christmas gifts.

And so that was one example of how we were willing

to like step away and outside of the box,

because what we weren't so caught up on was protecting the

margin in the leggings.

But we were using that instead as a tool to drive

more visits to our store.

Got it.

You weren't losing money on the deal,

correct? Yeah.

But you had it super low priced and only available in

the store,

not online Matt,

Correct? Yes,

absolutely. And sometimes,

you know,

we may even have an incredible stack Sioux,

but I may put a sign limit X number per customer

to encourage again,

repeat visits and also create kind of that sense of urgency.

You little sneak there's this book I read that said,

you know,

all marketers are liars and then it had it crossed out

and said storytellers.

And I said,

okay, I'll go,

I'll go with that.

I think That would be Seth Goden.

Is that right?

That sounds right.

Yeah. I love that.

All right.

So that is an excellent,

excellent idea for lots of us super because you get them

in the store and maybe they've known of the business before

they've driven by,

cause you already are in good locations,

but nothing has really gotten people to enter through that front

door before.

Absolutely. Another part of that,

that's pretty critical Sue that I believe is that once the

customer is in the store and they make that decision that

they're going to purchase,

so that customers come in,

maybe it was the fleece sign leggings that got them in,

or maybe it's some loud deal on something else or whatever

it is when the customer makes that decision,

they're going to purchase,

they're going to take out their wallet or their purse.

And they're going to move to the counter.

I believe that the customers at that point much more susceptible

that finding other things to fall in love with,

in our stores as well.

I would agree they're already going to be opening their wallet.

So what else is there that they need?

You got it.

So we're good.

I'm in that thought process.

And then,

Hey, then we'll take over and do our job to show

them a bunch of fun stuff and make it happen.

Couple of questions for you.

Are you able to retain some type of connection with that

customer once they've purchased for the first time email or somehow

be able to communicate with them later?

Yeah. Great point.

So we have a few standards in our business that no

matter what everybody must do.

And you know,

you asked earlier about kind of like the training and how

we train.

We don't want people to speak in a robotic way to

repeat a script like the ten-year-old that's trying to sell me

cookies and it's was just reading off their paper.

We want emotion to come through in the person.

But one of our non-negotiable things that every person must do

is at the point of checkout,

we ask every customer whether or not they're part of our

preferred customer club.

And so yes,

we do make an attempt and we don't take the first

objection. We train how to overcome objections and what some of

those common objections are.

And so I'm proud to say that that was one of

home and company today,

we have over 20,000

preferred customer club members.

Wow. Yeah.

And have some 4,000

email opens on each email blasts that we do so very,

very valuable part of our business.

Oh my gosh.

Yes. So successful with that,

for sure.

Especially the opens that tells me that you're putting some good

information in those emails.

Yeah. Trying to,

what do they look like?

Well, you know,

pretty consistent.

And so one of the things that we want to try

and do is keep them pretty short.

And typically we want to tell something that's happening in our

community. And so we never want to be solely focused on

just promotion.

So we want to have a little bit of a voice.

So we'll share like a calendar of events and call attention

to something that's going on.

Whether it's a free concert series or a festival of some

sort or whatever.

And then we'll highlight something.

That's not a sale item,

but it's typically a new product or great for the season.

And then we'll also highlight some type of offer,

call to action.

Everyone knows that when an email comes from you,

it's not going to be so salesy.

They're going to see some opportunity there,

but they'll also be some good information for leisure time or

well, you know,

whatever it might be.

Yeah. Quick question.

Before we kind of close this part up,

we've talked a lot about product mix because when someone comes

in, you want to make sure that they're seeing something that

they want to purchase in the beginning.

Of course,

you're just guessing,

you know,

you're going to buy whatever you think your customer's gonna want.

Clearly you can track what's working through sales.

Is there any other way that you're gauging what types of

products when you go to market and are starting to replenish

inventory and spice things up and get new things?

How do you know what to narrow in on?

Yeah. If I only had a great answer for that question,

you know,

that's part of the challenge and part of what we enjoy.

And of course what you said,

watching your sales and your analytics is an important part to

that. We read different trade magazines.

And of course our,

you know,

always have an eye on social media and different things because

oftentimes things can pop up out of there,

but I really go back probably to that networking piece.

So when I go to market,

I spend about as much time networking with other retailers as

I do working the sales floor or working on the show

floor, I should say.

And so just as I'll share information with them,

they will with me.

And I've always felt like if I know that something is

working in a couple of different areas,

or I hear it from a few different retailers I'll approach

that line or that concept with a little more confidence than

I would just discovering it on my own.

Very interesting.

All right.

The final question here,

I think it's so funny that your wife and her twin

brother said they would never go into retail and here they

are, Your in-laws Can probably do some of those.

I told you so,

but she is doing merchandising,

right? Yes.

So any tips for our listeners on displays?

Yeah. So in addition to her doing merchandising,

we actually employed two people that do merchandising for us at

our various stores and that's their only job.

So they come in and they're dedicated solely to that.

And I think if you have a brick and mortar store,

you've probably experienced this before,

when you get in something and you're super excited about it

and you get it out on the floor and for whatever

reason sales,

aren't what you anticipated.

Sometimes it simply takes a move or a fresh look to

bring that into the customer's view better or to give it

a better shot.

And so we believe that with merchandising that the most important

part of that is keeping the store looking and feeling fresh.

And so again,

it's one of those things that we want to do to

encourage the customer to come back as often as possible.

And so if someone was in our store four weeks ago

and they came back in today,

the store would have not a completely different look and feel

because our staple products are going to maintain their space,

but to be neat and orderly in their presentation.

But our impact displays our front displays.

The first things the customer sees that are more seasonal or

geared towards what's going on,

there's where we want to see the change in the movement.

And the same is true for our windows.

And I think that when you make that investment,

it tells the customer something maybe subconsciously or subtly that there's

things happening at this business.

This is an interesting place to be and kind of creates

that sense of discovery if you will.

So how Often do you change them?

Windows? The windows Are changed.

Probably. It depends again on the focus.

So they were changed for father's day and now they're 4th

of July themed.

And so after the 4th of July,

we'll transition into general summer.

So weeks they'll transition into fall.

And so they'll probably have to change outs in the fall

and then transition into Christmas.

So every three to four or so weeks,

but we don't like it to get much longer than four

weeks. That's for sure.

That's perfect information and so important because you're right.

I mean,

it freshening it up does say,

just like you're talking about that,

there's something going on that you're really attentive to the business.

Have you ever gone by shops and you're seeing the same

thing in the windows that was there even three months ago

or heaven forbid you see some tinsel from Christmas now,

You know,

there's this store downtown that they've been in business for like

115 years now,

I won't say the name,

but they have in their windows celebrating 100 years and it's

the same sticker has been there now for 13 years,

it's like update your sticker.

Well, you know,

it's those subtle things that you may be as a customer,

you don't even really recognize it,

but there's something about the store that just isn't as exciting.

You know,

you can't even necessarily put your finger on it,

but it's those little subtle things for sure.

All right,

man, let's switch this up a little bit and talk about

you and Jennifer in terms of how you've been able to

carry on and be successful,

brick and mortars.

We have seen,

you know,

best intentions for all the things you've talked about.

Have kept you going,

but what is it about you to maybe yourself or maybe

Jennifer or trait that has helped you guys either stay in

business or be able to stay in business together?

Because that's also a challenge.

Yeah, definitely.

We laugh about that a lot.

And of course in business you have different opinions and then

being a husband and wife and navigating those opinions and being

respectful to one another.

So anyway,

we've certainly navigated through a lot of things to put a

word with it or an attribute.

I think that just maintaining the focus on continuous improvement and

having that determination that never really satisfied.

And so I think that it's maybe a blessing and a

curse to say,

I've never feel satisfied.

That's not necessarily true either because I'm very satisfied in what

we do.

I love the work that we do.

I love going to work every day,

but in terms of being satisfied with the sales or with

where we're at in our business,

I think that just in kind of going back to what

I said with the candle thing,

when we want to complain about something being accepting and open

to looking at how you're impacting that result.

So if I'm upset about the way someone treated,

someone that I saw at the counter to not be upset

first with that person,

the sales person,

but to first look and say,

when is the last time I've had a touch point or

a on the floor coaching interaction with that sales person,

and maybe it's been three or four weeks,

or maybe it's been longer,

or maybe it was just the other day.

I don't know what the answer is.

It depends on the situation.

But first looking,

I guess,

at oneself and realizing there are things that I can do

and that I'm responsible for,

and I'm not going to settle or point blame.

I probably gave way more than one attribute or something.

But anyway,

I hope that makes sense to you.

No, I think it's a really,

really important statement because as a business owner,

you could blame as much as you want or to your

point, you know,

well, what is it that I could be doing better to

affect the situation?

So it doesn't happen again,

is the way you're going to be able to lead to

success. Because if you're always blaming,

yeah, that's great.

You may take the responsibility off of you,

but sales,

aren't going to go up employees.

Aren't going to feel satisfied and what could potentially happen to

the business.

The other thing I like that you're talking about with continuous

improvement is also,

if you keep changing,

you stay relevant.

If you watch what's going on in the environment,

you make adjustments so that you stay important to your customers

bringing in the right product.

I mean,

it goes through every aspect of the company,

right? So I think that continuous improvement is fabulous.

I appreciate your talking about it in that manner.

Is there any tool that you're using you have for sure.

Two stores,

did I kind of hear,

there's a third story in there somewhere.

Yeah. We have two ladies fashion boutiques,

Jean Marie's as well Holding out on us.

You know,

I don't want to get too complicated with the story.

Those came along a little later,

but yes we do.

Okay. So now not only multiple locations,

but multiple focuses and different brand names.

So there's a lot for you to manage here.

What type of tools or what do you use to kind

of keep everything under control?

Yeah. Great question.

Honestly, it's maybe not so much a tool as it's just

something you have to develop.

I believe in yourself and it's trust.

And to have people that you can trust to take over

the things that you don't need to be directly in control

of. And that was probably one of our biggest challenges in

the first few years of growing our business.

And to some degree,

probably a good thing,

because as you develop your business and you're developing what your

brand is and who your identity is,

there are certainly things that you want and need to control.

But what I'm talking about are the day-to-day things that we

sometimes feel like we need to do.

You know,

and I mean,

just the other day I'm sitting in my office is in

the basement of one of our stores.

And so on my long day,

sometimes I don't get upstairs and see the sunlight for several

hours. And the other day I'm sitting down there and I'm

plugging away and I spent a couple of hours and what

was I doing?

I was making labels or I was doing some small tasks

that I felt like at that moment needed to be done.

And I needed to be the one in control of it.

But I think that in order for us to grow,

we need to realize that we have people who are talented

around us.

Their ideas may not always be the same as ours.

And that's good too.

We have a great manager for our Jean.

Marie's our ladies clothing business.

She's very young and she has a lot of great ideas.

And she'll bring to me an idea about this thing.

She wants to try for a marketing event or something,

and she'll explain it to me.

And she'll say,

what do you think?

And I'll say,

what do you think?

And she'll tell me why she thinks it's a good idea.

And I'll say,

that's wonderful.

Marcy, give it a shot.

If it doesn't work,

let's not repeat it.

If it does,

let's tweak it and improve it and keep doing it.

And I think giving your people some power and some authority

to make decisions and to resolve some matters that don't tie

you up and making those kinds of mundane decisions and bogging

you down so that you have time to focus on the

most important points to grow your business.

Absolutely. I can hear just by that story,

I understand why people stay with you as long as they

do, because you give them ownership in the success of their

locations too,

and let them do their creative ideas in terms of business

building, without having to make the financial investment of a business

of their own.

It's kind of like,

they still do have the business of their own because it's

their idea.

Yeah, absolutely.

So where else you're talking about how you're networking and you're

part of the buying groups and all of that,

where else,

or what other things do you tap into so that you

make sure you stay relevant in the business,

whether it's,

you know,

books or conferences or masterminds,

whatever. Yeah.

The mastermind thing is huge.

We have a network of,

out of that larger group of retailers where we share consistently

we have a smaller group of about 14 or so of

us that share on deeper levels and have intentionally scheduled phone

conferences and callings with one another.

So that's a huge part of it,

but I also believe if anybody recommends a great book,

I love picking it up.

It's the one thing I wish I had more time to

read, but in the last year,

I've also really fallen in love with and discovered exactly what

you're doing in terms of the podcast.

And I think the podcast,

the amount of information that you can get that's out there

and just readily available to us and at our fingertips is

tremendous. And so just trying to be a lifelong learner and

soak up anything,

taking every little bit I can.

And that's one of the things that I think is awesome

about being an entrepreneur and being in business is that it's

kind of like this giant social experiment.

And if we make enough little tweaks,

the end result can be very beneficial.

Totally agree with you and give biz listeners.

I know you like audio since you're listening to the podcast.

And as Matt is saying,

same thing for him,

he's gathering a lot of information and there's so much available

for free.

Also books are available on audio.

I've teamed up with audible,

which is one of the places where you can go and

get audio books.

And I would like to offer if you haven't done so

already a free audible book on me.

All you need to do is go to gift biz,

book.com and make a selection there.

That's gift is book.com.

Okay, Matt,

I would like you now to dare to dream,

I'd like to present you with a virtual gift.

It's a magical box containing unlimited possibilities for your future.

So this is your dream or your goal of almost unreachable

Heights that you would wish to obtain.

Please accept this gift and open it in our presence.

What is inside your box?

All right.

Wow. That's kind of the,

sky's the limit here?

It's that law of attraction type thing.

Yes, I guess for me,

it's probably the most common term that I hear used in

our industry.

A lot is in it.

What I would open in your presence would be this crystal

ball and it would be a crystal ball that I could

look into and ask questions about what's going to sell,

what should I buy?

Where should I be?

What should we be doing?

Because I think that most things in our store environment,

of course we have control over.

And the one thing that we don't necessarily always have control

over is what new products coming in and where are we

should be investing our dollars.

And so I guess for me,

it would just be that magic crystal ball and it would

solve all my problems.

There you go.

Okay. Then if people want to see more of what home

and company is all about,

where would be a good single place for them to go?

Yeah. You know,

as good as a job as we do in the brick

and mortar aspect of it,

our online sales are very much lagging.

So if you go and you search our direct sales websites,

you'll probably be somewhat disappointed.

But my outlook on that has been,

I can either be a small fish in an extremely vast

ocean, or I can be a big fish in a small

pond and really focus on what we do well.

So I think online,

the more accurate representation of really who we are is probably

in our social media,

on our Facebook pages.

And you can find us by searching facebook.com

forward slash home and company or forward slash Jean Marie's store.

And you could check out a little bit about what we

do. One thing that your listeners,

some of them might enjoy is in our Jean Marie's store

on Facebook.

We do a lot of live Facebook fashion shows.

And so one of the ways that we reach our customers

is through the live Facebook fashion show,

which if you happen to take a look at it,

you'll see what I mean.

Oh my gosh.

I know we'll have listeners going over to that for sure.

I am.

I know I am and give his listeners.

You also know that there's a show notes page that will

be connected with this episode.

So I'll have all the links there of websites and the

Facebook pages for sure.

And I'll even put fashion show live or something there.

So that you'll know exactly which one that is.

So you'll have it all set for you.

So, okay,

Matt, thank you so much.

I really appreciate all of the information that you've given while

we were talking.

I'm kind of thinking like,

I might want to move there and work for you because

I really like the passion that you have for the personal

aspect of it.

You know,

interaction with the employees,

interaction with the customers,

not placing the blame game,

but turning the mirror on yourself,

as you're saying.

And I think all of those are such good skills.

It's no surprise to me how successful you are.

And may your candle always,

always burned bright.

Where are you in your business building journey,

whether you're just starting out or already running a business,

and you want to know your setup for success,

find out why taking the gift biz quiz,

access the quiz from your computer at Vic dot L Y

slash gift biz quiz or from your phone by texting gift

biz quiz to four four two,

two, two.

Thanks for listening and be sure to join us for the

next episode.

Today's show is sponsored by the ribbon print company,

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