365 – Pinterest Interest Targeting, Idea Pins and Promoted Pins with Cali Waege

Episode 365 Idea pins.

They are the pin format that is taking over Pinterest Attention.

Gifters bakers,

crafters, and makers pursuing your dream can be fun.

Whether you have an established business or looking to start one.

Now you are in the right place.

This is gift to biz unwrapped,

helping you turn your skill into a flourishing business.

Join us for an episode,

packed full of invaluable guidance,

resources, and the support you need to grow your gift biz.

Hey there,

gift biz on rap podcast fans.

It's your buddy,

Adam from podcasting business school.

That's the podcast where I teach people about podcast launch growth

and monetization strategies.

Check out episode two 20,

where I help you discover where you are in the podcasting

success timeline.

You are listening to the gift biz on rap podcast,

and it's time to bring out your host.

My pod pal SU Moen height.

Hi there.

It's Sue.

And thanks for joining me here today.

I'm so excited to give you an update on our first

gift biz bash.

If you don't know what I'm talking about,

this is something new that I've recently started for you.

The gift BizBash is a zoom party that provides a short

session of free live training,

and then a chance for you to shout out your company

and any promotions you currently have going on.

Or if you're interested in doing a collaboration,

you can give us all the details on that and perhaps

find your next biz bestie.

The first one was this past Monday,

and I can't wait for you to hear it.

It'll be coming up as a podcast episode in just a

few weeks here.

Why don't you join us for the next one?

Spots have to be limited so I can keep the bash

to about 45 minutes or so.

You can sign up for as many as you'd like or

pick and choose based on your availability to see the schedule

and to sign up,

go to gift biz,

unwrapped.com forward slash bash.

It's a hundred percent free.

You get to pick up a growth tip and also get

eyeballs on your business.

What could be better?

Gift biz,

unwrapped.com forward slash bash.

I'll see you at the next one today.

I'm bringing back our Pinterest expert Kelly waggy.

You may recognize her from a recent show.

Back in January during that talk,

we realized that there was so much to cover.

We needed to break it into two shows.

We're going to get into what I'm going to call specialty

areas of Pinterest,

specifically, interest targeting idea,

pins and promoted pins,

true to form.

Kelly has ninja tips coming your way to Today is my

pleasure to welcome back Kelly waggy of the Halcyon hive.

Kelly is a Pinterest marketing specialist and the owner of the

house Yon hive,

which is a marketing agency that helps female led creative businesses,

leverage Pinterest as a powerful marketing platform.

She helps her clients grow their business by getting new subscribers,

sales and leads through an optimized Pinterest funnel.

Consider this your part to an extension of sorts from episode

number 3 54,

that aired just back in January of this year.

In this prior podcast,

Kelly gave us a current look at the Pinterest platform and

the role that it can play for your business.

Very different.

I have to add than other social media platforms out there.

So I really do encourage you to go back and listen

to that if you haven't already.

But as we were talking at that time,

it became clear that there were other enhanced opportunities offered by

Pinterest that needed more time to do them justice.

So that's what we're doing here today.

A Pinterest 2.0,

if you will,

Kelly, welcome back to the gift biz unwrapped podcast.

Hi Sue.

I'm so glad to be back.

I know just a few months,

but we couldn't wait too long.

Exactly. It was like,

we just chatted.

I know.

Well, I wanted to put a little bit of space between

it because if you know how social keeps changing Absolutely.

This way we could capture anything else that was new in

the meantime.

Yes, definitely.

We talked about covering three main points.

So I think that's what we'll do for everyone who's listening.

Yes. We normally do a motivational candle,

but we did that so recently that I think we're just

going to pass that and go and dive in.

But Kelly,

is there anything that,

for someone who might just be catching this episode first before

the other one at again,

episode 3 54,

why don't you give like a real quick outline version of

your experience just to ground the conversation?

Sure. So I previously to being a Pinterest marketer,

I had a career in retail management and I got to

that point in my life where I needed to change.

I wanted to spend more time with my family,

have more flexibility,

not have to work weekends and holidays,

but I want to.

And so I made the bold decision to hang up my

career and start something from scratch.

It was definitely the scariest decision,

but the best decision that I've made,

especially doing that before the whole pandemic.

So I had a lot of flexibility and was able to

work from home.

And I really started out not in Pinterest,

but I wanted to do just kind of like VA work

or my sister has her business and I was helping her

out and wanting to do social media management.

And it,

over time I dug really into Pinterest as part of it.

And I just learned that there was so much information within

Pinterest and there so little information out there at the time.

focus in on just Pinterest and just run with it from

there. And like you said,

social media is constantly changing.

So it's keeping me on my toes and I've been able

to build my business successfully.

And a lot of my clients are through word of mouth

and I'm creating digital products.

And this year I'm planning on launching a course or two

on how to do your own Pinterest marketing.

So big things are coming,

but I'm really excited and where I'm at,

You know,

I'm feeling like Pinterest is such a breath of fresh air.

We were just talking before we hit record,

we were talking about the spring.

Ah, Yes,

We are both going out to walk after this podcast is

recorded. Everybody.

We just figured that,

that we had the same goal for afterwards,

but I just feel like there's so much pressure on the

other platforms and we've already laid the groundwork or ascertained that

Pinterest is more now a search engine versus a social media

platform and all of the details on how to set up

your account,

how to pin posts,

where things go,

please reference back to that other episode.

Cause we're not going to do that here,

but I'm feeling,

and you tell me if this is a good observation or

not Cali,

but I'm feeling like Pinterest is taking much more into account

the experience of the user.

Like they're not just looking at the social media platforms and

saying, oh,

my competitive platform is doing this.

So I'm going to add that feature in there,

looking at the experience of the user and then providing us

the tools that we need to accomplish our goals.

Exactly. Yeah.

They do look at the social media as far as what

are keeping people on their platforms.

And of course,

short form video is a huge thing right now.

So Pinterest has incorporated some of those features into theirs,

but the big thing that sets Pinterest apart from other social

media platforms is it's a search and discovery tool.

It's where people go at the very beginning stages of their

process, whether it's planning something or trying to get inspired for

a party or outfit or meals or anything like that,

they start at the beginning and Pinterest has evolved to be

able to provide a full funnel solution.

So you've noticed probably now that there's more and more shopping

opportunities on Pinterest,

more businesses uploading their catalog.

So people can go from this search and discovery and inspiration

phase all the way to the final checkout.

And this may span over a couple of months time,

depending on how long people's purchase funnel is,

but Pinterest has all of it.

Now it's right from the beginning to the end.

And that really sets them apart.

Yeah. It really makes for an experience different than the other.

My son is getting married next month and they've been doing

Pinterest boards,

of course,

the wedding party and the attire and decorations and all of

that. And it's been over the course of time.

Right? So then you see the boards.

And then so as you're saying,

it's discovery and thinking and capturing ideas,

and some of them may be you take off your board

and then add new ones,

you know,

whatever. And then you get to your final point and then

you know where to go to purchase.

If it's something that you're going to purchase versus doing yourself

or whatever.

Yes. So it's like a full end to end experience.

I'm thinking.

And to your point there,

it's also dynamic.

Pinterest looks at the content that you're saving and interacting with.

And we'll adapt to that at,

this is where that algorithm piece comes in.

And if you're in the beginning,

phases of planning your wedding and like the wedding shower and

things like that,

you'll start seeing more content shown to you for that for

inspiration all the way through,

you know,

if you're starting to pin honeymoon and post wedding stuff,

new home or whatever,

it might be your boards and your content that you're interacting

with evolves and Pinterest evolves with you.

So you're constantly seeing what you're interested in Love.

It absolutely love it.

So I'm glad what I'm seeing and understanding is what you

would also say is happening there.

So I feel like I'm on track.

You are,

I'm still learning Pinterest myself too.

All right.

Well, let's dive into these three topics.

The things we're going to be talking about today are idea

pins, interest targeting,

and promoted pins.

Do we just take them in order or is there a

better one to start with?

Actually, maybe let's start with interest targeting cause that's kind of

ties in with all of it.

So let's start there.

So interest targeting might actually be something kind of new to

a lot of users.

We're familiar with keyword targeting SEO,

things like that.

So the interest is very similar.

It's the way Pinterest,

as they are looking at the content that we're engaging with,

they are tagging our account,

our boards pins,

all of that.

They're tagging it with interests and you can find those interests.

If you were to go and set up an ad,

you could do interest targeting through the ad there.

But if you look at those different interests,

like home decor,

modern farmhouse might be one home decor would be like a

level one interest.

Then modern farmhouse might be like a lower taxonomy on that,

but there's going to be thousands and thousands of interests across

Pinterest. And they're developing them based on people's behaviors and the

names of boards that they're creating and the pins and all

of that stuff.

There's so many things that they look at.

And so when I say interest targeting,

you want to use that when you're optimizing your account.

And I think we talked about optimizing your account on the

previous episode,

but we talked about using those keywords that people would be

searching well.

You want to kind of think of it a little bit

bigger now and look at the interests that people would be

searching. And there's actually a pretty cool little trick that you

can, if you have a Pinterest account already that you can

kind of audit and see if your pins are being tagged

with the right interests in one way to do that is

to click on one of your pins and then bright below

the pin.

You'll see related pins that show up.

If those related pins are the same themes and ideas,

colors, the visual piece or the content piece,

if they're the same,

then Pinterest has index your pin correctly.

They know what it's about.

If you go down there and this has happened to me

before where I'll look under a pin and it'll be completely

random things,

don't look at the promoted pins.

Cause sometimes those get popped in there and they're a little

really fit in,

but all of the organic ones,

if they're not matching up with the content that you're sharing,

then it's telling you that Pinterest doesn't really know where to

put your pin or who to show it to,

and that pin's not going to perform as well.

So what you want to do is to optimize and to

improve. This is to create,

it starts really with the boards.

That's going to be kind of your foundation with this.

You want to create boards using the interest words.

So before what I was saying in the previous episode was

creating boards,

using keywords like social media marketing would be a keyword.

Pinterest marketing might be one but interest.

It's kind of tricky because they don't have a list that

you could just go to.

And here's all the interests that you can pick from.

So the ways I do it as if you're on your

business account,

you go into analytics and then audience insights from your account.

And when you look at that,

the very top of it it'll show categories and interests.

And if you click on the category,

that's most related to your business,

then look over to the right of that.

And you could see all the interests that are tied to

it. So you can grab those words from there and create

boards from that.

Interesting. Yeah,

I know this is completely new from what I was talking

about last time and it goes hand in hand with what

I talked about.

So we're not changing gears completely.

We're just adding a new layer on to elevate the optimization.

We're perfecting what we have here.

Exactly. Yeah.

What comes to mind for me as a potential mistake is

similar to a mistake that we could make with hashtags.

Yes. If they're still relevant,

cause that's a whole controversy unto itself.

But let me use myself as an example,

because it's easier for me to relate to this.

So I'm trying to attract people who are handmade business creators.

Right. But I have a podcast which is one of the

ways I do that.

If I were to create an I'll have to go back

and look at our accountancy,

see what we've got,

but a board that were to say podcasts,

then I would be creating something that is of interest potentially

to other podcasters,

not necessarily the audience of handmade creators that I'm looking for.

Right. That's true.

So just like how,

if you are saying that on Instagram,

all your competitors are following you.

Well, that's because you're probably hashtagging all your competitors,

what they're seeking to come to you.

Right? Right.

So That's something to think about as we're creating the boards.

Now I have to go back and look at that Cali.

Yes. And another little trick that I learned,

and there's a really awesome course.

And I can give you the information after,

by, I can't think of the gal's name,

the, her businesses levy studio,

but she has some Pinterest courses and she looks at a

lot of the technical pieces of Pinterest and the developer blog

or the engineer blogs.

So there's a lot of really good high tech like information

she shares,

but she's the one that's been testing this interest targeting and

seeing great results with it.

Okay. So look at the boards and how your boards are

titled. And I don't think that means that you have to

change your whole board in terms like rearrange all your boards,

but maybe just adjust your titles of the board.

Yup. It's really,

the title is going to be the key thing.

So the other little trick you could try is if you

right, click on a board and open it up in an

incognito tab or like a private browser.

So it strips away all of the login information.

It's just,

it gives you what it is.

But the cool part about doing that is it will actually

show you right above at the top on that page that

opens, it'll show you the interests that it's being tagged to.

And that's another way you could see the actual word,

but the interest that they're tagging it with.

So incognito mode open a board or open pins in that

private browser in Cognito.

And you'll see even more information.

You'll also see other keywords that Pinterest has tagged here account

or that board or that pin.

So that's something fun.

You should try that out on your account.

And you'll find a lot of cool information there.

And none of this sounds like a really difficult fix either.

No, not at all.

That could really have some good traction capability if you will.

Is there anywhere on Pinterest where you can see a list

of all the interest words that they use so you can

highlight which ones you should be going after.

So there's not a,

an easy way to get the list.

There's not like a direct link to a full list.

There's a spreadsheet that I've come across before,

So it's not updated.

But the way that I will look at it is a

couple of ways.

So I'll look at it through the audience analytics under your

analytics tab or audience insights rather.

Yeah. That's what you told us before,

right? Yep.

Did we got that one there?

Yep. You'll see interest there.

And then under the ads manager.

So if you go into create an ad,

you'll get to the step under the ad group where you

can select interests and that's where you can literally,

it's kind of a breakdown list of all of them.

So you would just find the ones that are relevant to

your business.

And it's really important that you use the exact spelling.

You know,

if they had an S on the end,

like if it's plural or if there's no S that's how

you want to type it out as your board title for,

if you're using it in a pin title or description,

make sure you're using that exact spelling that Pinterest use.

So those are two ways and the other way would be

to do that incognito mode.

And if you click on those interests that they're showing you

up the top,

you can kind of reverse engineer it by clicking on that

interest. It'll show you all of their top ranked pins that

are tagged with that interest.

And then at the bottom,

you'll see like more topics like this,

or it says something like that.

Those are more interests.

So it's just kind of poking around and playing.

You might want to make your own list.

That's what I've done for my business.

As I've just kind of poked through and have a running

list of mine that I just keep adding to.

And with mine,

for marketing,

I've got stuff you're towards small business,

let's say marketing stuff.

So you've got to kind of think a little bit out

of the box too,

with, like you said,

podcast, because you have a podcast for creators,

but you also might get people who are wanting to start

a podcast or things like that.

Exactly. But also podcasts as a good topic for small business

owners. So that is a good one still to have on

it, even though it's not a direct relation to your audience.

Okay. And I'm thinking,

you're not just going to take the interests as they're laid

out there and just title all your boards that Not all,

but you will do something.

And then could you do another board that includes the name

kind of like a long tail keyword.

So it has the interest as part of a longer title.

Yeah. So for example,

I have a board,

so I have social media marketing,

which is an interest.

Pinterest marketing is not an interest,

but I also have a board called Pinterest marketing.

So if I create a pin,

that's talking about Pinterest marketing tip,

I would pin it to both of those boards using that

interval scheduling that I spoke about in the previous episode.

But yeah,

you want overlapping boards with those interests and then the long

tail specific keywords for your business.

And that's going to give you the best SEO and the

best indexing,

I guess,

for Pinterest,

the more information you give them to tell them what your

content is about and who is interested in or who to

show it to the better your account will perform and your

pins will do Beautiful.

Okay. And I loved putting this one first,

because if this isn't set up,

right, no,

one's going to find you.

None of the rest of the stuff will Work.

Exactly. Just like the solid foundation of business that we always

talk about.

Absolutely. Yes.

One final question has come to mind about this Pinterest targeting

and naming the boards.

If you have 40 boards and only five of them are

in exact match of those interests,

the others are deviations from it or all that.

Should you always be making sure that those five boards continue

to have new content put in so that they're kind of

weighted higher?

Yeah, that's a good question.

And I would say yes,

I would pin that first.

And I believe I mentioned this previously,

the first board that you add a pin to,

so you created a new pin and you're going to be

publishing it on Pinterest.

Now the first board it goes to is the most important

board. So you want it to be the most optimized,

I guess you'd say.

And using those interests as board titles and in the descriptions

and so on,

you're giving it to Pinterest on a silver platter.

You're saying,

this is exactly what this pin is about.

So I always recommend pinning it to those interests boards first

followed by that specific keyword board.

The other thing I do is also look at the boards

in your analytics overview,

looking at your board performances,

cause some boards based on your audience might perform better.

So you also kind of want to leverage those boards.

So if there's a board that has really great engagement,

that means you've got the right content and it seeing the

right people.

So that's something you want to look at as well,

but it most likely will be one of those boards.

Okay, perfect.

I don't recall hearing that and I feel like that's a

super valuable and ninja love it.

All right.

Wonderful. Anything else on interest targeting that we should talk about

here? No,

I think that kind of covers it.

Okay. Yeah.

We agreed that we'd be careful not to spend too much

time on like,

not being favorable to one of the three more than another

clearly. If there's more questions you guys reach out to me,

reach out to Cali,

you know,

search online,

whatever, but we just want you to know what's available and

to give you some understanding underneath it,

where here,

I feel like with the interest targeting,

we've really got that covered now.

All right.

I'm good idea.

Pins. Let's roll All the details about idea.

Pins are coming your way right after a quick break so

that you can hear from my other business,

which also happens to be the sponsor of this show.

Yes, it's possible increase your sales without adding a single customer.

How you ask by offering personalization with your products,

wrap a cake box with a ribbon saying happy 30th birthday,

Annie, or at a special message and date to wedding or

party favors for an extra meaningful touch.

Where else can you get customization with a creatively spelled name

or find packaging?

That includes a saying whose meaning is known to a select

to not only are customers willing to pay for these special

touches. They'll tell their friends and word will spread about your

company and products.

You can create personalized ribbons and labels in seconds,

make just one or thousands without waiting weeks or having to

spend money to order yards and yards print words in any

language or font,

add logos,

images, even photos,

perfect for branding or adding ingredient and flavor labels.

To for more information,

go to the ribbon print company.com.

I'm sure by this point now everyone has seen or used

idea pins.

They are the pin format that is taking over Pinterest.

They're the newest pin format.

So what I'm saying,

pin format,

I mean like a static,

you got your regular static image pins.

You have video pins,

there's carousel pins and collection pins,

which are pins that you can tag multiple products to.

And so you can kind of see a little collection and

then we have idea pins.

So when they rolled out a year or so ago,

they were initially called story pins.

They've since changed the name to idea pins.

I think there was some confusion between Instagram stories and they'd

work kind of like that,

but they are evergreen.

They do not disappear after 24 hours.

They're on Pinterest forever,

just like your regular pins.

So they are idea pins.

So the idea for idea pins is you want to inspire

people to take action.

So some of the things that you can create that depends

for would be maybe step-by-step guides,

whether it's a,

like a DIY project or a recipe,

they'll see a lot of those you can upload or record

video just like you would in an Instagram story and just

do it on the fly and record it.

Or you can create these idea pins and upload them.

You can customize them using fonts and colors and music.

And a lot of things like the Instagram stories,

there's not quite as many options,

but there's still on there.

If you have a shop on Pinterest,

you can tag your products.

So that's kind of a great way to feature like a

product Roundup or gift guide or things like that.

And you can tag other accounts.

So if you're working with an influencer or something like that,

you can do that as well.

So these are all really great features of the idea pins.

They also,

because they're new Pinterest wants to feature them a little bit

more and push them out there.

So you generally will notice an idea.

Pin will get more impressions and more engagements in a shorter

period of time.

So that's really exciting because as we all know,

Pinterest is a slow burn and those pins that we create

take a lot of time to build up in views and

engagements and all of that.

So I always recommend,

especially for people who are just starting out on their Pinterest

account, their business account to sprinkle in these idea pins,

maybe one or two week,

just to kind of give your account a little boost.

Now another benefit to these idea pins is once you get

through the steps of creating it,

and then you get to the end,

you choose a board.

You want it to go to,

so again,

we want to put it to that relevant interests targeted board.

And then you can add a little description.

You can add details,

whatever it might be,

that pin is about.

It's a great place to add your keywords.

And then you can also tag this just like if you've

created video pins where you can tag topics to it,

these are those interests.

There's another place those interests are showing up.

So you can tag up to 10,

they call them topics on here,

but they are the interests.

They're the exact same wordings that you can tag up to

10. And you want to try and tag all 10,

if you can,

or as relevant 10 that you have,

but tag them on there.

And then you go ahead and hit publish.

Now you can't schedule these on tail when you can only

create them on Pinterest in the mobile app or desktop.

But the one downside I was going to mention.

So the little,

I guess,

caveat that I would say with idea pins and where a

lot of people are a little hesitant to use them is

you don't have a link on them unless you tag products,

but they don't.

So if you have a blog post,

you can't link your blog posts.

So pins aren't clickable,

they can't click through.

So that's the downside to it.

However, because these are getting more reach and engagement,

more people are interacting when they interact with content from your

account, they start to see more of your content and more

of your content would be pins that do have links.

So I always recommend adding a call to action at the

end, whether it's follow you for more visit your website or

visit the link on your profile or so on,

that was a mouth full of stuff.

What are your questions?

No, that's perfect.

But it leads to a question.

Let's say I make a step by video tutorial.

And I put that in as an idea pin my,

do everything that you said in terms of the topics up

to 10,

there's no link.

So I've doing the call to action.

And so that video exists as a full video on Pinterest.

Now, can I take that same video and make another pin

that talks about whatever the wording would be that relates to

the video and link it to go over to like YouTube

where I house the video?

Yep. You definitely can.

So basically,

yeah, you'd be creating another pin,

a whole separate pin.

A whole Separate pin.

Yeah. Yep.

But you could use that video that you already recorded and

maybe throw a text overlay on it to give it context

and what it's about.

And then yes.

Have it linked to your YouTube or to your website.

Okay. So Pinterest doesn't recognize them that,

gosh, this is the same video length,

the same wording,

the same person.

And like,

Nick's one of them.

That's a good question.

I haven't,

haven't actually tested that theory out at the algorithm is so

curated Because it would have to go through the link to

see it.

Yep. Exactly.

What I do is I create in my link that I

have on my Pinterest profile,

I've actually created almost like a links page,

like Instagram and I created,

I just duplicated my Instagram on from my website.

And then I claimed that link.

And so I have that as my bio link.

So when someone clicks on that,

it goes to a links page.

And if I have some trending idea,

pins, I'll feature what I'm talking about in there,

if it's a product or a blog post,

so that it's right there for them to click on.

And then at the end of that idea pin,

I just say more information and the link of my bio.

So that's one option to do it as well.

That's way up leveling our sophistication here.

No, but I was just wondering like,

if there are people who have done YouTube videos already,

if they could take that and make it an idea pen,

so they could actually start idea pins this afternoon.

Yeah, absolutely.

Yep. You could.

So the idea pin,

I guess,

ratio or aspect ratio,

is there a little bit longer than your regular two by

three standard pin?

So they're like a nine by 16 ratio.

So I think it's like,

I don't know,

whatever. It's just a little bit longer.

So I use Canva.

You can just create a template and cam actually there are

some idea pin templates in Canva already that you can use.

And you've literally,

yeah, just drag in your photo.

I do recommend if the video is kind of long because

each page on your idea pin can have up to take

us a minute on each page and you can have up

to 20 pages.

So that's 20 minutes of video,

obviously. No one's going to stick around and watch all of

that. People like short and quick to the point stuff.

So keep that in mind.

If I even have a one minute video,

I'd still break that up into about 30 seconds pages.

So one page would be the first 30 seconds.

The next page would be the second 30 seconds of that

minute video,

just so that people can skip ahead if they wanted to.

It's a easier cause like on tic-tac and other things you

can't drag the timeline slider to different points.

If you want to get back to the beginning,

you have to literally like go back and start it over

if you wanted to see something.

So just a little tip is to break it up into

smaller clips of a video.

Got it.

And you know what?

I have a app that I use on my phone that

helps with that called cut story.

Oh yeah.

I've heard of that.

Yep. That would be perfect.

So you could take that too.

And honestly,

like let's say you have a training video that you've done,

that you like it so much.

You feel really good about it.

The tips are very clear and concise.

Maybe what you do for an idea pin is just edit

and cut out those individual points without the,

all the other talking and description behind it.

And those turn into a step.

Yeah. Idea,

pin that then for further information,

they can go somewhere else and see the whole thing.

Yep, exactly.

That's a great idea.

So I'm just trying to show that there's ways of using

content you might already have and do some idea pens.

Yeah. And if you utilize tech talk or Instagram reels,

or if you have a series of Instagram stories and a

highlight, these are all great things to repurpose for idea PIBs.

Oh Yeah.

You've already got them.

And a lot of them already in that format,

the nine by 16.

And so get those a tray.

Ooh, no there ninja tip Kelly.

Yes. Oh gosh.

Okay. So that's very cool.

And like you said,

we all know that reels are like the thing for Instagram.

So idea pins are the thing for Pinterest.

Yes. So perk up,

we got to pay attention cause you know how sometimes we

wait until the strength of it subsides a little bit.

Cause everyone's jumped on board.

Don't do that.

No, get on it now.

Do You use idea pins now?

Yeah. Yeah.

I have noticed from when I first started using idea pins

back when they were story pins,

I have noticed that initial boost in impressions isn't quite as

high as it was in the beginning.

So that's a little bit of a bummer,

but when you're creating those idea,

pins use the trending search con or whatever's trending in search.

So if you go to trends.pinterest.com,

you could see like what currently this week is trending on

Pinterest and it gives you all like the majors.

So there'll be like home decor stuff,

recipes, fashion,

and beauty.

And then just like a general like random stuff.

Like if it's holiday focused.

So look at those and those are great inspiration topics to

take, to create idea pins around.

Or if you already have some content,

if fits into any of those trending posts,

that's a great thing to do because you already know that

people are searching for that stuff right now this week on

Pinterest. And so it'll help get more views on your pin.

Perfect. That sounds fabulous.

Like, honestly,

that is so amazing because we obviously,

we're always wanting more eyeballs on our content and if we're

going with the trend,

you're just putting it all in your favor.

Right. Exactly.

Yup. So,

all right.

Super idea.

Pens, anything we need?

I think we're good on idea pins.

Okay. Now promoted pins.

Ah, yes.

Promoted. I think that means advertising Holly.

It does.

Yep. We're putting some money behind the pins now Let's do

it. All right.

So yes.

So before starting ads,

I do recommend making sure your account is optimized.

I've seen accounts that don't have like hardly any boards or

they don't have any bio filled out in their description and

all that.

And they're running ads.

People are going to be coming back to your profile and

you want to be able to tell them what you do,

what you offer to them.

So do have your profile,

your account optimized before starting ads.

And I know Pinterest is not social media platform,

but you know,

how on Facebook,

if you have attracted the wrong audience by mistake,

and then you run ads to your audience,

you're running ads and pain for viewership of people who aren't

even a potential customer of yours.

Yeah. Does it work the same way,

which is why optimizing beforehand and making sure that you're attracting

the people that you want beforehand before you start advertising it,

is that why that's so important?

Yes. That's really part because Pinterest is looking at,

like you said,

they look at the content,

the boards that you have on your profile,

the pins that you're sharing or engaging with saving or sharing

and your profile name,

that your bio,

all of that.

But after this interest targeting Pinterest is tagging your account with

certain interests.

And if they know what your account is about,

then they know these pins that you're promoting along with the

other ad setups,

the targeting that you'll be doing when you set up your

ad, but it just adds that layer of optimization to help

get your stuff in front of the right people.

So yeah,

definitely have your boards set up your profile filled out and

it makes it look more complete.

It just makes it crystal clear who it is that you

want to be.

Absolutely. Yep.

Okay. Perfect.

Okay. So we're optimized.

Yeah. So you're ready to promote a pin.

So there are a few different Pinterest campaigns or promoted pin

campaigns that you can run there's awareness campaigns,

which are basically pins to get out there in front of

new audiences,

new people to just discover your name and your brand.

There are video campaigns and that's kind of along the awareness

campaign where you're promoting a video pin.

Basically. I don't really do a lot of those because they

tend to be more expensive and don't always get the return

on ad spend that you want.

That's important because normally we say videos,

everything it Is.

Yeah. But so in terms of ads and we all have

to test it for our own accounts.

Right. Just to know,

but you're saying that you can't take it as an assumption

that if you would do a video ad,

it's going to perform better.

Yeah. And the reason for that is a lot of the

bigger budget businesses,

the big names out there,

they have the budget to put a lot of money behind

these videos and you're going to be competing against those budgets.

And if your bids and things like your budget's not big

enough, it's going to use up that budget right away in

the beginning of the day and then it'll be gone.

So I don't start out with ads.

I do recommend,

like you said,

testing it out at some point,

once you've figured out the right campaigns and the targeting that

works really well for your business.

That's when you want to test out some of those other

formats. But yeah,

that's a good point on that one.

Okay. Couple more types of campaigns.

So the one that I generally will start with would be

a consideration campaign,

and that's just a basic campaign that is optimized to get

people to click on your pin.

So it's a little bit different than the awareness campaign.

They're both based on the cost per click.

That's how they're built.

But the consideration campaign,

they used to be called traffic campaigns.

They're getting your pins out in front of people who are

more likely to click on it.

So that's great because clicking needs,

they're going to go to your website or to the link

that you're promoting to.

But in the beginning,

they're not necessarily the audience that are more likely to convert

on that website or on your,

whatever your thing you're promoting.

So what I recommend is starting with this consideration campaign after

two to four weeks,

if you are getting enough people who come to your website

and have whatever your goal is,

if it's to get email signups or to get check out,

if you have gotten Pinterest says 50 in a day,

I have done it 50 in a week.

If you put that in 50 conversions in a week,

then you could switch to the next type of campaign.

So you basically just switch it over to a conversion campaign.

And that conversion campaign is going to target people who are

more likely to convert.

So consideration campaign is to get people to click.

Once that campaign becomes optimized and smart enough,

we could switch it to the conversion campaign.

And now we're going to target people who are more likely

to convert.

Now you're probably thinking,

why don't we just start with the conversion campaign?

Because obviously we want people to convert well,

the conversion campaign needs enough data on your Pinterest tags,

the pixel,

you know,

the tracking information,

they need enough of that in order to perform well.

And you can't start out because you won't have the data

on it.

So you gotta start with that consideration.

So they wouldn't have enough data on the individual ad or

on your account.

Overall, The other thing,

when you're beginning to set up your ads,

or before you run ads,

you need to have your Pinterest tags installed on your website.

So those,

if you're familiar with the Facebook pixel,

Google tag manager,

like Google tags,

things like that,

Pinterest has their version called the Pinterest tag.

So you need to have that set up properly so that

it would trigger whenever someone visits at any page on your

website. And then if they add something to their cart,

another end event tag called the add to cart event will

fire. And then if they've complete the checkout,

the checkout tag will fire.

And then if they sign up on your email list,

there'd be a signup tag.

So those are the events that measure conversions that they're they'll

fire. Anytime someone goes through that.

So not just people from Pinterest.

So if someone comes from Google or Instagram and they sign

up on your email list,

that tag is still gonna fire.

So then this is where you can create warm audiences.

You can gather that audience data,

and then set that up in your targeting.

So when I was talking about that conversion campaign,

it's looking at the data on those tags.

So your conversion will go for people who are more likely

to add to their cart or more likely to sign up

on your list or whatever you choose as your goal.

Okay. And as with Facebook,

there's one pixel for you for an account.

So you have one pixel that you placed different places.

Is it the same thing with Pinterest?

Pinterest is a little bit different.

It's you have your base code?

That's like your main pixel.

And it's just like a little string of code that you

put in your head section on your website and it has

to fire on every single page.

So it depends on your website platform.

I know Squarespace has a place where you put it one

spot and it shoots it across the whole website.

I use show it for my website and I have to

put it on literally every single page in the head section.

So it takes a little bit more work to do it

on show it,

but so it depends on your website.

So that's the base code.

And then the event codes are kind of little offshoots and

they have to go after that base code.

So there's a little bit more work there.

It's not quite as easy as the Pinterest one,

unfortunately, but I help with this.

That's one of my services and there's a lot of other

people who can,

there's a lot of information out there and education on how

to set this up.

Okay. So that needs to be the course you're making this

year. I'm just going to say Noted.

Very good.

Okay. So a base code is the code for your entire

Pinterest account.

And an event code could be like a campaign that you're

running for.

Something specific.

The event code is the conversion.

They action.

That happens.

Yes. So you need all of those in place so that

when you're running a campaign,

you can optimize towards one of those actions that you want

to get the add to cart or the checkout or sign

up. Okay.

Here comes another question.

Yes. So I've got my base code there on my website

on every single page,

but I have multiple things that can happen.

Like maybe there's multiple products people could buy and they go

then through my checkout,

wherever that is.

Right. Because I'm thinking of all the different situations.

So I'm not going to do that.

I'm just going to talk in theory.

Yes. So that's like a checkout code.

So you only need one checkout code.

You don't need one checkout code per product.

Yeah. And again,

it depends on your platform you're using so Shopify,

if you have an account on Shopify,

there's literally like one button you click and it'll add your

codes across all of it.

So I recommend if you're planning on starting or setting up

a shop on your website,

go with Shopify.

Triple underline.

I agree.

Yes. I use thrive cart,

which thrive cards great for funnel building.

So if you have like a course and you have little

products you want to add on Thrivecart is not great for

like building a shopping cart where it's like,

you know,

I want to buy three of these and one of these,

but thrive cart is I have to put my tags on

each individual product.

So again,

it really depends on the platform you're using,

whether you need to do it on each page or just

once, but those event codes need to.

So if you do have different price points on your products,

you need to have a dynamic variable in that code.

And this is getting a little,

like really high up.

But basically what it's telling Pinterest is anytime someone adds something

we'll say,

add to their cart,

Pinterest will know how much,

what the value is of that product.

And then when they check out,

so you can,

that's how they measure your return on ad spend,

because they can see,

oh, they checked out and paid this much for the product

and you pay this much on ad and then here's what

your income from it or the return.

So, Alright.

I don't want everyone to be like,

oh my gosh,

my head is spinning.

I'm never doing Pinterest ads.

Exactly. It will scare you away.

Yeah. Like the way to think about it is Pinterest ads

are available.

It's a little bit different than Facebook,

which I know a lot of people here haven't even ever

done Facebook ads.

So, but instead of thinking of the whole picture and all

the variables,

all the things we were talking about,

if you're not at that level,

if you're thinking of running an ad,

you can start with what would it be for you and

then figure out what your solutions are based on.

Are you on Shopify?

Are you here?

Are you there?

You need to know that you would need to put a

base code in.

You'd need to know that then you need some event codes

and then you can Google search.

You can get Kelly's course that she's going to create.

Yes. Like there's ways to find the information you need versus

look, you're not turning into a Pinterest ad specialist.

You just need to know the information that is applicable to

you. So please do not shut down right now when the

conversation, but let's continue talking about why promoted pins,

like any more detailed that you think you should give us.

So we have some of that information,

whether it's applicable to our situation or not.

I did want to mention one more glimmer of hope for

people. Pinterest also offers free ad support.

So they don't help you set up your ad and get

your tags installed and everything,

but they can help you with the targeting part,

like getting your ad as far as choosing what campaign to

set up,

what pins even have pin design specialists that can help with

that. And then they will recommend a budget.

Generally they will recommend a little bit higher than what an

independent ad strategists like myself might recommend.

So that's something to consider.

As you know,

if they say start at $50 a day,

you probably could do $20 a day and still see some

positive results.

It really depends on the industry you're in and the competition.

So I'm not going to get into all of that.

But Pinterest does have for some free ad support helping.

And if you go into your ads page or your Pinterest

account, they talk about it all over the place.

They'll say like,

let's set up a call or there's different ways to contact

them. It's so it's good.

You can offer,

you can try that as well.

If you want to dabble in and just get some Pinterest

experience. Okay.

Couple of questions,

you know,

how on Facebook,

if you do an ad,

you can create the ad.

And so it sits on your feed if you will.

And then you promote the ad.

Yep. Forget The whole thing about dark ads on Facebook,

but so on Pinterest,

is it the same way?

Like you create the pin.

Yep. So you can promote a pin that you've created in

the past.

That's existing on your account,

or you can create a new pin and you have to

save it to a board.

So you are creating an actual pin,

but you can do it in the ad setup.

If you didn't have the right pin that you want to

promote and you actually want to promote,

when you're running a campaign,

you want to select four or five pins for that campaign

because people interact with different pins.

So it's a good way to test out the visual piece

of it.

Well, conversion campaign,

I think is pretty easy because if I'm selling a product,

I might have a couple of different images that sit on

a couple of different boards that all lead to the same

product purchase.

Right? Awareness could be several of my high performing pins that

are topics around,

which I talk,

sell whatever my business is.

Right. Because you're trying to attract awareness to the account.

Exactly. Yep.

All right.

I got that all.

And then after my expenditure has run out,

like I've put a limit on how much I'm going to

spend after it runs out that pin still stays on the

board where it was before.

Yes. That's why it's really important.

Not to put any limited time like information,

because there is a way that if you set a start

and an end date,

I do believe that you can run up,

they call it a flighted campaign.

So like a short-term campaign for sale or something like that

would remove the pin.

You create a pin in the ad setup.

And then once that campaign ends,

it would remove it from the account.

You can do like an expiring pin or something.

Yeah. Automatically go away.

But if you don't want it to,

then don't put any deadline information in the content.

And one thing too to consider is Pinterest.

Organically takes a long time to optimize SEO and everything.

Pinterest ads take a little bit longer than a Facebook ad

might. So keep that in mind,

you do want to run a campaign for probably a minimum

of four weeks.

So if you're like,

if you think you've got a sale here coming up and

the sale runs for a week,

I probably wouldn't use Pinterest as the platform to promote it

on. You'd probably want to do a Facebook or Instagram,

but if you are trying to build your email list for

a launch or maybe an upcoming sale,

and you want to just get people to your list,

then that's something you could run for weeks ahead of time

just to kind of grow and build.

You want to kind of think about the strategy that way

too is you need to allow time when,

when you start a Pinterest ad,

it takes about two weeks to initially optimize.

They call it the learning phase.

After that week,

mark, it's more optimized and it's getting to the right people.

So like I said,

I give it the next two weeks after that.

So a four week campaign to try.

And if you have a checkout goal,

if you want to make income from it,

you want to give it at least that four weeks to

try and get your ad spend back.

Because those first two weeks you'll probably feel kind of dismal

about it because you're going to see it spending and you're

not going to be getting the checkouts.

Initially it does take time for it to optimize.

So something to keep in mind,

as far as timeline on campaigns.

And that just falls in line with the whole feel of

Pinterest too.

You're making an investment over time.

Yup. Very on-brand.

Yeah, exactly.

Which is one of the things I love about Pinterest.

You're not putting up posts that are going to disappear.

Like let's face it.

Whoever goes back and scrolls down.

People's feeds Exactly.

Versus Pinterest,

that search,

if you're optimized,

that'll pop up.

Even if you did it a few years ago.

Exactly. And those are the pins that perform the best,

the ones that have history.

So yeah.

Yeah. Okay.

So my next question and we already did,

one of the answers is how is this different from Facebook

advertising and campaign time is clearly one of them.

Yeah, that's really,

the biggest thing is the time it takes for a campaign

to optimize.

And another thing would be right now there's more and more

advertisers getting on Pinterest.

But right now it's still a little less expensive to run

on Pinterest than it is to run a campaign on Facebook

that may change as more and more advertisers,

jump into the pool here To know,

okay. Qualifier for this point in time.

Yeah, exactly.

In the cost for the ads will vary throughout the year.

Obviously Q4,

they're going to be more expensive because more advertisers are running

them. So that's another thing to consider.

But the other thing to think about when choosing between Facebook

or Instagram or Pinterest would be just knowing your audience and

how they're using those platforms.

Like I said,

Pinterest is a search and discovery feed.

So if people are starting to plan a gift for someone

or they're buying a house and they want to redecorate or

refresh in the spring or something like that and your content

or your products fall into those categories,

then yes.

Get people where they're at in their buying cycle.

So get them in the beginning when they're just starting to

research with your organic pins,

things like that.

And then you can retarget them with your ads,

with the products that you carry and so on.

So it's kind of a,

you want to think this is kind of tying it all

up into a bow here is have that organic strategy where

you're creating inspiration tutorials,

product reviews,

or testimonials,

all of that all the way to you're running ads,

to get people to your list.

Maybe you offer a freebie and then you about the sales

funnel set up through email list,

or you're running a campaign to your products to get the

checkouts. Think it's a full funnel.

It's all right there.

So from organic to the pain.

Yeah. And I think that's so important.

Don't just say,

oh, I'm going to run a Pinterest ad.

So you've run a Pinterest ad.

Like where does that fit into the whole strategy you have

for acquisition?

And then in terms of visibility,

acquisition of a viewer to your website and your Pinterest account

and all of that through some type of a getting acquainted

type situation that leads to a sale,

you know,

it's not just cold to sale.

Yep, exactly Wonderful.

Oh my gosh.

I have to ask this question again,

cause I want to make sure we're not missing anything,

but anything more you think we should cover on promoted pins

or are we good for now?

There's two more types of campaigns and those are shopping campaigns.

So I didn't really get into those,

but that's,

if you have your shop set up on your Pinterest account,

or if you have Shopify and you've linked it to your

Pinterest and you can run shopping campaigns and shopping campaigns are,

they're a little bit different.

They're really geared towards your data on your Pinterest tag on

who to target.

And they're set up a little bit differently than those main

campaigns like that consideration the awareness and the conversion.

So I didn't want to dig too deep into them And

these are going directly to a sale,

right? Yeah.

Those are going directly to right to the products.

Just sort of one thing I failed to mention.

Okay. And did you say there were two more types or

just that one While there's going to be your regular shopping

campaign, like a prospecting campaign,

and then there'll be retargeting and their dynamic retargeting campaigns.

So meaning if someone visits a specific product on your website

at one point,

then you can retarget them on Pinterest by showing them the

specific products or Pinterest will know which products they've looked at

and we'll show those randomly throughout Pinterest,

just like a,

Hey, remember you checked this out.

Got it.

Okay, wonderful.

So if your head is spinning,

I want to go back to,

we're just presenting you with all of the potential that's available.

Save this podcast.

You can go back and listen to it.

If you like,

and just take the pieces that you need for the time

being right now.

Like if you're looking at Pinterest,

but you haven't really done anything yet,

go back to the other episode,

3 54,

listen to it,

open your account,

optimize your account.

You're already another step along then take the next step and

then take the next step.

You don't need to know all of this.

When we're talking about a show,

we're trying to talk and hit points for everybody at every

skill level,

every experience level that there is,

right? So you only need to take back what is good

for you at this point in time,

but know how to get back to this episode.

So when it is time for you to be doing all

this sophisticated stuff,

you'll have the information here as well.

All right.

So we've covered so much here today.

Where can people come find you get some more information,

maybe look at the course when it's available.

Do you see how I keep nudging you about that course?

Cali Inability to get it done?

Absolutely. Yeah.

So you can find me on all the socials at the

healthy on hive.

And my website is the healthy on hive.com.

So I keep it the same all across the board.

There you have my email list.

You'd be notified when that course is launched,

but I'm probably,

well, I haven't been super active on Instagram this fall spring

kind of a while,

but I'm hoping to get back into that,

but definitely hop on my email list.

That's probably the best place to get the most updated information.

Well, like I said,

I am so excited about Pinterest and you are the girl

to help us out for sure.

I really appreciate you running through these three higher level things

that we weren't able to do the last time.

Thank you so much for coming on the show.

And I think it's now time for both of us to

go out walking.

Yes, indeed.

I can't wait.

Have a good day,

Kelly. Thanks.

You too.

Okay, Kelly,

I've given you enough hints.

You have to let us know when that course of yours

is ready.

Today is April 9th,

2022. So if you're listening to this show way in the

future, just access Kelly's website from the show notes and get

the most updated information about that.

My feelings about Pinterest becomes stronger with each and every new

learning I have about the platform.

It's a breath of fresh air.

And it just seems to me that the time dedicated there

gets way more attraction and longevity than social media,

and recently announced after our recording of this episode.

So you may not have it yet,

but if you don't,

you will have it soon.

You'll be able to share your pins over to Facebook and

Instagram. I'm sure we'll be hearing a lot more about that

as it rolls out before you move on to your next

activity of the day,

make sure to get your name on the list for at

least one gift biz bash.

You can see the dates for April and may and all

upcoming bashes.

Again, if you're watching this later over at gift biz,

unwrapped.com forward slash bash,

if you're enjoying the podcast and would like to show support

for the show,

a rating and review is always fabulous,

but there are other ways for you to get something tangible

in return for your support to visit my merch shop for

a wide variety of inspirational items like mugs,

journals, water bottles,

and more featuring images and quotes to inspire you throughout your

day makes a great gift to,

and I've just added some new products for the season to

the shop as well.

Turnaround is quick and the quality is top notch.

You should expect nothing less.

Take a look at all the options over at gift biz,

unwrapped.com forward slash shop.

All proceeds from these purchases goes to help offset the cost

of producing this podcast and now be safe and well.

And I'll see you again next time for the gift biz

unwrapped podcast.

I want to make sure you're familiar with my free Facebook

group called gift is it's a place where we all gather

and our community support each other.

Got a really fun post in there.

That's my favorite of the week.

I have to say where I invite all of you to

share what you're doing to show pictures of your product,

to show what you're working on for the week to get

reaction from other people and just for fun,

because we all get to see the wonderful products that everybody

in the community is making my favorite posts every single week,

without doubt.

Wait, what aren't you part of the group already,

if not make sure to jump over to Facebook and search

for the group gift biz breeze don't delay.