354 – Achieving Pinterest Success is Very Different from Facebook or Instagram with Cali Waege

Gift biz unwrapped episode 354.

It's almost like taking your Instagram and Google and they had

a baby together.

And then you have Pinterest At Tinton gifters bakers,

crafters, and makers pursuing your dream can be fun.

Whether you have an established business or looking to start one.

Now you are in the right place.

This is give to biz unwrapped,

helping you turn your skill into a flourishing business.

Join us for an episode,

packed full of invaluable guidance,

resources, and the support you need to grow.

Your gift biz.

Here is your host gift biz gal Sue moon Heights.

Hi there.

Thanks for joining me today.

I'm on a high after our fabulous national bakers crafters maker's

day celebration yesterday.

I can't believe that it's come and gone so quickly.

There's still time for you to enjoy some of the activities.

If you've missed it.

There's our memory board,

a wonderful feel,

good space to read all the heartwarming messages inspired from handmade

products. Think of this as an affirmation board about the emotional

impact, what you make can have on another person.

And you can also still watch all the classes.

We had 20 minute sessions yesterday on yoga,

journaling, meditation,

gift, wrapping,

salsa, dancing,

and even pie crust making to see all of this,

no log-in or purchasing required,

go to handmade,

heals the world.com

today on the show,

I know you've been looking forward to more on this topic.

Pinterest, you're going to hear why pins are so valuable and

how to get the most out of your pins,

including ways to attract the right people,

your ideal customer.

One thing I'm really enjoying about Pinterest is how very different

it is today than Facebook or Instagram.

It didn't start out that way.

So if you haven't had an update recently,

you'll find this really interesting.

And honestly,

it's so refreshing.

Plus, here's a question for you.

How would you answer?

Are hashtags appropriate these days for my pins?

Yes or no.

Are you sure?

Let's get into the show and find out if you're right

Today, I'm really excited to introduce you to Kelly waggy of

the house.

Seon hive.

Kelly is a pin tastic marketing guru.

She helps service providers and product sellers increase traffic,

client leads and sales using Pinterest.

She says,

it's time for you to stop crossing your fingers.

Hoping that one of your many pins that you've posted will

go viral and get you the traffic that everyone's been talking

about. Kelly's going to be our guide today to teach us

the strategy and tactics to get the results that you've been

hearing of.

Kelly. Welcome to the gift biz on wrapped podcast.

Hello, Sue.

I'm so excited to be here.

Thanks for having me on,

Oh my gosh.

I'm not even kidding.

When I talk about the popularity of Pinterest with my listeners.

Oh yes.

So I know this is going to be an exciting one.

Everyone's on the edge of their seats,

ready and waiting to hear what we have to talk About.

Got some good stuff.

But before we do,

I'm going to keep everyone in suspense for a second.

Cause we have to get to our candle question,

given that all of our listeners are creatives here.

I love to get a little bit of a different look

at who you are,

Kelly, by having you describe a motivational candle.

So if you could share with me what that candle would

look like by a color and maybe a saying,

or a quote or something,

what would your motivational candle look like?

Yes. I absolutely love this question because I love candles.

I always have them birding.

They kind of just help get me in the zone.

And that's kind of my theme around the candle that I

chose as a productivity and focus theme.

So I like my candles to kind of match my setting.

And so the candle itself will be really neutral,

like a neutral ceramic jar,

something maybe handmade.

I just love that.

And the scent would be something productivity focused or you know,

something to reinvigorate me like a Rosemary or citrus or something

centered. Or if it's around the holidays,

I do like a holiday sent to the quote that would

have on it would be consume less and create more.

I'm an overthinker.

A lot of times I love to research and plan and

brainstorm and all of that.

And my execution tends to lag.

So my motivation would be to shut down the consuming so

much and just do the next thing.

Just create more content,

create more products and create more education for everyone out there.

So that would be my motivational candle.

You know,

it really makes sense.

And I see that's where a lot of us kind of

fool ourself a little bit.

And I probably shouldn't say this because here I am a

content maker,

but I think we fool ourselves into feel like we're working

really hard on our business when we're consuming,

we're taking another class,

we're going to another trade show or listening to another podcast.

I hate to say it exactly,

but then never implementing what we've heard.

Like it's such a good idea in the moment.

And then we get off and what happens in order comes

in, we have to make a product or we have to

ship a product.

Right? Exactly.

I've got so many great ideas in my head and I

just need to get them out.

So maybe 20,

22 will be the year.

I'm really pumping that stuff out.

Yeah. Well,

and let's make a caution to everybody,

even before we dive in.

Think of things that you're listening to,

that you hear here that resonate with you and write it

down right now.

Even if it's only like one or two things of the

kazillion things that Kelly's going to share with us,

even if it's one or two things only that you're able

to bite off,

you're farther along than you were before you were listening.

I fall into this trap too.

So it's a reminder for me as well.

For sure.

All right,

Kelly, what led you to Pinterest?

Yeah. Well,

I've been on Pinterest since the creation of it back when

it was invite only,

I don't know if the website is still around,

but there was a website called stumble upon.

I remember that.

Yes. And I was in there.

You know,

you put your interests and everything in there and you just

hit the button and it like shuffles you a random website.

And Pinterest was the website it gave me,

or one of the times I did it and I was

like, well,

this is kind of cool.

Cause I hated my bookmarks tab on my browser because it

was just,

you never go back and look at the stuff you bookmark.

And I love the concept.

It's a visual Pinboard and at the time you couldn't just

sign up.

It was invite only.

So I had to put in my request to get an

invite and I was on a wait list and then it

finally came through and then of course I got into it

and loved it.

And I started sending,

like I was inviting my family and friends to it and

it just kind of started from there.

So it was just a personal thing,

unfortunately was after my wedding was already planned.

So I didn't get to use it for my wedding.

But shortly after that I had my first baby on the

way. And so I got to use it for planning that,

and then we bought our first house and so I did

get to use it for the fun planning stuff.

So then it kind of just fell by the wayside for

a little while.

And I got into a retail leadership career.

So I was a manager at Macy's and I went over

to target and I did visual merchandising and sales management and

different things like that.

And I was just getting burnt out.

I had two kids now at this time and I was

at target and I was working every other weekend,

missing all the holidays with my family.

And my stress level was just up there and I knew

something had to change.

And I had been talking about it for the past few

And I knew I was at my breaking point.

I needed to change.

And I talked with my family and my sister who has

her own business.

She's in fact,

she was my first client when I started this because she

has her own online business.

And she was my big motivator and mentor when I decided

to leave my career that I had had and start my

own business.

was honestly the best decision I made to leave that career

behind and start this new one.

And it actually started out more of a social media management.

Like I was going to cover all the social medias for

clients, but I quickly realized with my sister as my first

client, I was doing her Instagram and her Pinterest.

And I'm not that great with the Instagram marketing on my

own business.

And I didn't feel comfortable managing other people's because I wasn't

confident in myself with that.

But Pinterest,

I dug into her Pinterest and it was amazing what I

was able to do.

She already had a fairly large Pinterest account just for blogging

and such,

but I was able to shift her audience because she created

the non-line shop where she sold website templates and custom logos

and things like that.

I was able to help shift her brand on Pinterest to

her business brand and saw that change in what I was

able to do through the marketing.

And I was like,

whoa, this is really cool.

I need to teach more people how to do this and

help more people do this.

And from there I knew Pinterest was going to be my

only focus I wanted to get in that.

There's plenty as you guys may know,

there's plenty to learn on Pinterest and it is constantly changing.

So it kept me busy enough with just the one platform.

So that's kind of how I got into Pinterest.

And just over the past few years,

seeing the evolution on Pinterest for businesses,

for e-commerce sellers and creators and things like that,

and it's been phenomenal and I'm just wildly passionate about teaching

it and sharing it with the world.

So I know there have been a lot of changes,

but going back to your experience with your sister,

was she an,

a personal account and you switched her account over to a

business type account?

I think,

But as a business to start with,

but her audience was all geared around her lifestyle blog.

So she did home decor and fashion and whole 30 and

all those like lifestyle blog themes.

And she wanted to kind of get away from doing that

and focus more on she's a graphic designer,

website designer.

So she wants to help brands create a beautiful brand that

they love.

So that is a different audience from the people looking at,

you know,

her home decor and stuff.

So looking at her analytics on her Pinterest,

there's one called audience insights.

And if any of you guys already have a Pinterest account,

it has to be switched to a business account in order

to get the analytics.

But if you look at your audience insights,

you can see what level of interest your audience has in

certain topics and categories.

And so I looked at that and I saw the majority

of our audience at that time was interested in food,

fashion and home decor.

And now that I've been working with her on it,

you know,

it takes time to shift an audience.

You've got to change the content you're sharing on there.

And so on and after about a year looked at again

and now her audience is primarily interested in design branding,

websites and that kind of stuff.

So I was able to shift it over there and there's

an analytics tool,

right on Pinterest that shows what kind of content is your

audience specifically interested in and their level of interest in it.

So they call that the affinity.

Okay. So that's super interesting.

And it makes sense for your sister because her blog was

about one thing.

And then as she changed her business over,

I don't know if her blog was also a business or

just like personal interest,

whatever, but still it was on Pinterest and then changing it

over to be doing something different.

This is an interesting thing because she kept the same account

when you were able to change the audience over.

So I'm thinking for people who are listening,

the first thing I heard from you,

Kelly, is if you're looking at a Pinterest account for business,

then change the account to a business account.

Even if you were initially personal,

because some of your personal contacts will probably be still interested

in what you're doing for business too.

Right? Yeah.

That's actually a big question.

I get quite frequently for people getting started is I have

a personal account.

Should I switch that to a business account?

Or should I start a new account from scratch?

That is a business account.

And my answer for people that are wondering that is,

and the reason why people ask is because a lot of

times when you have a personal account,

if especially if you started it back in the early Pinterest

days, you probably have a lot of followers because we probably

pinned your recipes and things that you found on the internet.

And people love that stuff on Pinterest.

So you have a lot of followers are ready and you

might be thinking,

well, I don't want to lose my audience that I've already

built up.

Now, the questioning to ask yourself is the audience that you've

already acquired on Pinterest is that your target audience that you

want for your business.

And it may be for some people and it may not

be for others.

So if it is your audience,

I would say,

just convert your personal to a business account.

And if it's not your audience at all,

if you're not sharing recipes and things like that,

and that's all you pinned on.

And that's what people are interested.

When you look at that report,

the audience insights,

that's when you want to just create a new account and

you can make it simple,

they have a way of setting it up where it's a

linked account.

So you have one login,

but you can toggle between a personal and your business account

because when you create a business account,

the only content that you want to be creating and sharing

on it is going to be the content that will attract

your ideal customers or clients or leads,

you know,

that audience.

Okay. So what about if you have any crossover,

If you have a little bit of crossover that's okay.

You really want to think about what is your goal for

Pinterest? Is it just to get more eyes on your website

or your shop,

or is it to grow your email list or you may

have different goals with Pinterest.

Sometimes it's just awareness,

like get your brand name out there.

But sometimes people actually want to make sales and grow their

email lists and stuffs like on my business account,

I do have a few boards that are not business-related.

I keep them secret,

just so I don't,

you know,

if I'm painting like a cocktail recipe,

like just for the weekend,

you know,

whatever, the people pinning that may not be interested in my

Pinterest strategy in education.

So I try and just keep any personal content on secret

boards on my business account,

and then just business-related content on my public boards,

Just business pins,

viewable, but you can still use your business account for personal

use. You just keep them secret,

just Keep them secret boards,

and then it won't be shown.

So Kelly,

And I'm just saying this as my experience,

I am an advocate for one Pinterest account and I'll tell

you why I have two businesses.

And I obviously have a personal life when I first started,

and this is something I did wrong.

I had multiple social media platforms for all three,

one for one business,

one for another business,

and then one for personal.

And it was a nightmare.

And what would happen?

I do nothing because it was just too confusing,

too much.

I was overwhelmed.

You need to consistent,

you need to be posted like you need to be showing

up everywhere.

Like what,

you know?

Yup. I totally Get.

Yeah. So I'm just going to caution everybody.

I really liked better because you can always add another Pinterest

account later if you want to.

Right. Absolutely.

Yeah. But so if you're thinking about business,

switch your account over to business,

unless it's a total disconnect like who you have versus the

audience you're trying to attract.

If it's a total disconnect,

start a new one,

but focus on that new one then,

and focus on your business account.

If you're looking at Pinterest for business,

which is what the topic here is versus following and doing

the chaos that I created for myself.

And then what did I do back to your point?

I did nothing.

I had consumed like all these channels,

cause I thought I needed to.

And I really did also for placeholders to be quite honest.

So no one could take my names,

but to be actively working them and focusing on them.

No didn't happen.

Exactly. So for people who may be less familiar with Pinterest

and more familiar with some of the other social media platforms,

how is Pinterest different?

Yes. I love this question too.

So a lot of people generally will associate Pinterest as a

social media platform,

but it's really a lot more similar to a search engine.

It's a visual search engine.

So it's almost like taking your Instagram and Google and they

had a baby together and then you have Pinterest.

So it's less social in the way that you go to

a social media to see what people are up to and

things like that.

You go to Pinterest to search,

to get inspired,

to plan.

So Pinterest users are going there for specific reasons.

They're typing in those keywords,

just like a Google search bar.

They're typing in how to blah,

blah, blah,

or something inspo or inspiration,

whatever it might be that they're looking to learn about or

discover or get inspired by.

That's what they're going to Pinterest for.

And that's what sets it apart from those other social media

platforms is that,

and this has kind of gone back and forth like the

follower count on Pinterest.

Some people get really hung up and really want to grow

that follower count,

but a follower count.

It doesn't have the weight that it does on Instagram or

your other social platforms.

So don't get hung up on the follower count.

It's really more about SEO.

And that's the big thing with Pinterest is you're really going

to hone in on your keywords that your brand is known

for and knowing where to put them on your Pinterest account,

like the pins and the boards and things like that.

So that when someone searches for something in that category,

your pins are showing up in front of them.

Okay. So you're less concerned about how many people are following

you and who is following you versus the content that you're

putting up.

That's then going to attract people who would also want to

buy things that you sell.

Exactly. So engagement on Pinterest is important,

but engagement is a little bit different than it is on

the other platforms.

So engagement on Pinterest would be,

they click on your pin,

you stop the scroll,

as they say,

they saw your pin and it caught their eyes.

So they clicked on it.

So that's one form of engagement that Pinterest will track on

the analytics.

And then of course saving pins,

that's going to be engagement.

And then we used to be called a click through,

but now they call it an outbound click.

But that means they clicked on that pin to go to

your website or to whatever that destination URL was.

Or if it's a video pin,

a video like view is also an engagement.

So the engagements are important because even if someone just clicks

on your pin,

that's telling that Pinterest algorithm,

what they're interested in and it could be Pinterest looks a

very sophisticated visual technologies so they can see what is specifically

on that pin.

Like what is the image?

What is the text overlay?

And then it indexes that and saves that and will then

show that person more content like yours.

Or if you have more content of your own that they

would, you know,

it will continue to show this person when they go to

their main feed.

Now, so engagement is important to really tell Pinterest what your

content is about and then who to show it to.

So someone else with a similar interest as this one person

who clicked and engaged with they could be shown your pins,

even if they've never come across your content before,

but because they have a similar interest as this other person

who engaged with your pins,

I feel like I'm getting convoluted with this,

But what I'm also thinking,

as you're talking through all of this is engagement is really,

really different between let's just use Facebook and Instagram because that's

what everyone knows.

So well,

instead of adding in everything else,

but engagement then on Pinterest is interacting with that pin.

Like you said,

clicking and saving outbound or video views versus a lot of

what's being talked about on Facebook and Instagram now is direct

messages and that one-on-one behind the scenes under the platform.

If you will direct one-on-one engagement.

So very different there,

which makes me start thinking,

you know,

everyone talks about,

oh, I'm an introvert.

Or I don't like to talk to people or whatever Pinterest

Is great.

Pinterest might be a more comfortable platform then Exactly.

When you get comments on pins or if someone messages you,

that's always great,

but it's not a heavy consideration on the success of your

account or your stuff.

So it's really more,

yeah, just that saving and the clicking and those things.

So opposite Of what Facebook and Instagram are right now.

That's interesting.

Okay. So then how do we figure out what we're supposed

to be pinning?

That's going to be interesting.

So the big thing,

like I said,

Pinterest is really heavily focused on SEO.

So what are people searching for?

So Pinterest has a really cool tool that they rolled out

maybe two years ago.

Now it's called the URL is trends.pinterest.com.

So it's a Pinterest tool they created and it's all about

what's trending.

So you can go on that page and look at what

is currently trending.

It shows like the main categories,

like what's trending this week,

it'll have like a little summary and then it'll show what's

trending in food.

What's trending in home decor and what's trending in fashion.

And then like there's holiday stuff,

it'll show that,

but they also have a search bar.

So you could type in one of your keywords that your

brand is known for.

So I could type in marketing or I don't think they

have Pinterest marketing on there yet as a specific search term,

but they're always adding new terms.

So you may not find your term on there,

but you know,

you could type in marketing or if you're a creator,

you could type in whatever the category is that your product

is. And you can see,

it'll show you the past 12 months of search history and

search volume.

So if you type in a few different words and compare

them against each other,

you can see how different wordings might have a higher search

volume on Pinterest than other words.

And then also times of the year.

So a lot of times you'll generally see a dip in

the summertime and unless it's a really summer focused product or

something like that,

but dips in the summertime,

it'll pick up in the fall.

And then of course,

Christmas time things dip off cause people aren't on Pinterest quite

as much,

but it's nice to be able to see what's currently trending

as far as planning out your content and when to pin

things. And it also gives you ideas like different ways to

write descriptions,

which words should you use.

And you can see what other pins are trending.

So you can get inspiration on the visual piece of the

pin. Like what do those pins look like that are showing

up high on these trends searches.

And then you could kind of replicate that in your pin

designs and so on.

So the trends tool is probably my favorite tool for planning

content and knowing what to pin.

And also just looking at your analytics on there.

If you have your Pinterest account,

even if it's been inactive for awhile,

go into your analytics,

just under analytics and overview.

That's the report you'd go into.

And you can see when you scroll down below,

what are your top pins?

So you could see what type of content that you've pinned

in the past that resonates with your audience.

So you can kind of feed off of that and create

new variations.

Whether you're creating a blog post,

you can make some kind of alternate blog post,

or if it's like a Roundup post of top products you've

made, you could just make a new pin and link it

to that post again.

That's totally okay.

Right? Because this is something that I've learned from prior interviews

is the destination of your topic.

In other words,

what your pin talks about and then where it sends somebody

to, you can do multiple pins that send people to the

same place,

which is so awesome,

because then all this that you're creating,

whether it's a blog article or something,

you're leading them to on your website,

whatever, you can have multiple images and multiple wording.

And it directs back to the same place.

That is so cool.

Yes. I love that.

Say you create a blog post and I encourage you to

create like maybe five or seven pins for that,

with a few different wordings on the text overlay or on

the title and the description.

They all link to this one URL.

But after a couple of months,

look back and see which of those pins perform the best.

And then you can kind of start seeing those trends.

And, oh,

my audience really has a higher engagement or more clicks on

this one that has like a button like read now or

click here.

So then I would start adding that to more pin designs

or colors.

You could see colors or even those keywords,

which ones are showing up in those pins that are really

highly engaged with,

on your account.

Got it.

Okay. So anyone who is just now thinking of Pinterest,

so you are a true beginner.

Keep listening because we're going to get to you.

We're kind of doing this the other way around.

We're talking to existing Pinterest people first,

but stay tuned because I have a couple of questions for

Kelly if you're just starting out.

Okay. But let's continue on with someone who had an account.

And let's say they're one of these people who decided that

either they're like your sister transitioning from one business,

focus to another,

or they switched their account from personal to business.

What do you do with the existing content that's on there.

If it's questionably appropriate for your new direction,

like it might be,

it might not,

you don't want to just clean it out and have nothing.

They are.

Do you delete things?

What do you do with all?

I would say,

absolutely. There's never any need to delete any pins.

I would say,

if you click on it and it goes to a dead

link, if it's on your website or if it's still relevant

content to your website,

you could create a redirect if you want to.

But otherwise you can just leave it.

It's not going to hurt your account at all to leave

pins. You'll find that a pin that you created or pinned

a couple years ago,

even it could be months,

two years ago could get a resurgence.

It could come back up.

And it depends on that search trend.

Like if something is trending right now and people are searching

for that,

created a pin or some content around that a year ago,

and it got zero traction when you pinned it,

it might start coming up now.

So if it's something that is relevant to your business,

keep it there,

keep it in a board,

make sure the board that you have at pin two,

or this goes for any of your pins,

make sure your boards are specific and make sure the titles

of them are keyworded while they're not some cutesy,

kitschy fun name.

Cause those aren't search terms,

you need to use actual words that people might search.

So boards are searchable.

Yeah. Board titles are searchable.

So make sure you have pins that are specific to that

board title in that board because Pinterest looks at that.

They look at what pins are in the board,

the description you wrote for your board and the board title.

And that helps Pinterest know what that content and that board

is about.

And then who to show it to.

They know like,

oh, if this board is about Pinterest marketing and someone's doing

a search for pin designs or something,

the content that I have in my board could start showing

up for those people searching for that.

Even though they're not searching the Halcyon high of Pinterest marketing.

So that's the cool thing with Pinterest is that 97% of

searches on Pinterest are unbranded.

So you can go up against these big name,

creators and brands and still show up.

It's all about that SEO and that keywording.

So now if you have a pin that has been on

your account for a long time,

and it's not relevant to your business,

just move that to a secret board,

keep it there.

It's not hurting it.

And like I said,

don't waste time deleting pins.

It doesn't help or hurt your account.

It's just a waste of time.

Okay. Cause this is a question I was going to get

to with you reorganizing the board.

So let's pretend like your sister,

you had a lifestyle Pinterest account lifestyle,

meaning let's go with,

I'm creating this on the fly here.

It was a personal account and you were showing decorating ideas

and recipes and maybe these boards are actually things that you've

pinned to your boards that are other people's.

Cause I know that's very popular versus creating your own content,

but so you have those kinds of boards and it was

workout ideas,

maybe, you know,

inspirational music,

like all that kind of thing.

Okay. And now you've changed to a business.

And so now you're going to have boards that are named

and are appropriate to whatever your businesses,

but then can you go back and rename some of these

other boards and just change the titles?

So they're more appropriate,

you know,

like foods that will fuel you for productivity or like,

I don't know what the titles would be.

Things like that.

Like you could keep all your content there,

but change the category.

So it's more in alignment for your time off,

like I'm thinking or to keep you strong.

I don't know.

But you know what I mean?

Like to change the athletic one,

to be more why you want to be working out so

that you stay healthy for your business,

you know,

things like that.

Yep. I think that's a great idea.

Like pulling in those key words that would make it,

like I said,

relevant to your business.

That's a great idea.

And I love the use of the keywords for that.

I think when you go ahead and do that,

what's more important than us.

The next steps is to just,

you know,

I wouldn't continue to create or pin new content to those

boards. I mean,

I get here and there,

it's fine,

but I wouldn't regularly fuel those boards with new content.

What you want to focus is on creating fresh content that

leads to your business stuff.

You know,

whether it's your blog or your products,

things like that,

That content that you're creating,

that you hope other people will pin to their boards so

that it all directs back to you.

Yep. And this has been something that's changed over the years

as well,

but there's no ratio of requiring you have to pin or

repin a certain number and then create your own pins.

You can do 100% pins of your own that go to

your own plain URL on your Pinterest.

There's no requirement to repin other people's content anymore.

So that's why I said,

it's for Pinterest marketing.

If you have the content,

if you have enough to create and repurpose of your own,

just focus on that because that's,

what's going to get people to your website.

Now, if you're a newer business and you don't have a

lot of content yet to create for Pinterest,

you still want to be able to tell Pinterest what your

account is about.

And that's where you'd want to be.

Repinning other people's content to boards that you've created,

that you will eventually pinning your own stuff too.

So that makes sense.

It does make sense.

It's going to make more sense when we do what I

want to do next.

Let's take somebody who is like,

Pinterest, I've never been on it.

I'm not sure what I could even do with it,

or they've been on it for a minute,

but have never thought of it for themselves.

Let's make a mock business and let's walk through the first

things that they would do to get up and started.

And again,

consume less,

create more like the few steps to get you going,

because we all know once you get traction going,

you're going to keep going.

You know,

it's just that getting started part.

So Kelly,

this is an essential oils business.

So she makes essential oils to promote wellbeing and health and

meditation. You get the vibe here,

right? So what does she do now?

She's heard this,

she's thinking,

Pinterest, what does she do is one of your goals for

this year,

a new approach to social.

Are you finally admitting that you're spending far too much time

there without seeing anything in the way of results?

Or do you jump onto Instagram planning to post,

but get caught up in all the fabulously produced reels,

then you get intimidated and step back.

Yeah, me too.

We know at this point we should post consistently with quality

content, but when it comes time to actually do it,

figuring out what to post is overwhelming and time consuming.

That's why I created content for makers.

Last year.

Many of you have purchased this high value,

low cost program and have new found ease in your posting.

And guess what?

If you already have content for makers,

there's no need to purchase it ever again.

One in done because it teaches you a posting strategy and

prompts that are timeless and can be used over and over

again. Now,

based on your feedback,

I've enhanced content for makers to include a hard copy,

social media scheduler,

because makers like tangible planners where we can add our own

creative punch to the mix,

right? Drum roll,

out your topics,

whether they're for social media,

blog articles or videos,

all in one place.

Now to clarify,

this is not your daily planner,

this is focused on content planning.

It includes direction on how to nail down a strategy,

monthly cues for new content and your own images.

And it can be used in conjunction with content for makers

or as a standalone resource.

Finally feel in control of your content with a strategy and

purpose, not just something random that you think of on the

fly to publish that day.

Intentional content saves time.

So you can focus on other business tasks and attracts customers,

which brings eyes to your brand and orders to your cart.

go to gift biz on rapt.com

And now let's get back to the show.

The first thing is just creating that account.

So go on there.

And like I said,

a business account.

Now, the reason why you want a business account,

just thinking ahead here is you'll have access to those analytics.

You can claim your website,

you can run ads.

There's just so many more benefits to it.

And like we talked about earlier,

you can have personal content,

you can pin your recipes on secret boards on your business

accounts. So just start with your business account And secret means

only you see them.

Yep. It's a private board that only you can see.

So set up your account,

like just use your email address.

It's really easy to set up.

You just follow the prompts as you go along.

And then now you have your brand new empty little Pinterest

account. So now you want to do here is it's really

important. You need to know,

and this is just like any business you want to know

who your ideal customer is,

who are you trying to target?

So get that in your head.

Think about that a little bit.

And then you also want to think about what content are

you going to be sharing.

So we're going to create your boards.

And if you're in the essential oils business,

so you might want to have boards that are like you

mentioned around wellbeing self-care and meditation.

So have a specific board.

So you might have one board that is essential.

Oils might be your main keywords.

And so that's your product.

So it might be essential oils for productivity,

essential oils for sleep and relaxation.

And then you can have other boards that are not essential

oil focus,

but wellbeing and wellness focus.

So you might have meditation tips,

things like that.

This is really good.

So essential oils.

It's not repetitive to have essential oils as the title of

a couple of boards because that's one of your important keywords

and send board titles are searchable.

That would be a best practice to use those words over

and over again.

This is where you'd want to use that trends.pinterest.com.

That trends tool,

when you're doing your keyword research here and have a document

open on your computer or a notebook next to you and

start typing in some of these words.

So like I said,

central oils for sleep and relaxation.

You maybe type that in to Pinterest,

whether it's in the trends tool or just in the Pinterest

search bar and look at the pins that are coming up

and just kind of see what words they're using,

what phrasing and jot those down when the ones that are

showing up at the top.

That means they're indexed really well,

I guess you'd say in the search vocabulary,

I guess.

So those are ones that you want to take note of

and then create boards.

And when you're creating your boards,

create a board description to where you can elaborate a little

bit. It doesn't have to be over the top,

just make the board description like one or two sentence of

what the board is about,

make it a sentence.

Don't what they call keyword stuff.

Cause I know that was a thing to do a while,

like years ago where you would just list out all the

keywords that would be related to that board.

Pinterest don't want you doing that.

So just write out a sentence as if you're Talking to

somebody, here's what you're going to find in this board.

Exactly. And I don't know if this question will come up,

but you don't need hashtags in your board,

titles or descriptions or pins.

Pinterest doesn't really do hashtags anymore.

They've come out this earlier this year and said,

don't do hashtags.

Can I say amen to that?

Yes, I agree.

But what happened is again,

they try to be part of the social media club and

they wanted to get on the hashtag train,

but hashtags are just search terms and people just type in

their words,

they don't put hashtag whatever the word would be,

hashtag essential oils.

They would just type essential oils.

So it ended up what happened with hashtags is that when

people would put them on their pins,

like I used to back in the beginning when they were

encouraged to do that,

I would say,

do a hashtag with your brand name.

So I would have hashtag the Halcyon hive on all of

my pins,

just so that if someone saw my pin,

they could click my hashtag and then see all of my

content. Well,

that's cool.

And all except the scammers and the people who don't play

right play well with everyone,

they were abusing it and they were stealing tens.

That way they could find all your top performing pins and

then steal it and redirect them to their website.

So people were abusing hashtags.

So don't use hashtags.

It's all about just the keywords.

And then they also,

I don't know if you've heard the term long tail keywords,

but it's just a phrase basically of your keywords,

like a three word.

It's a more detailed description.

It sounds like a phrase,

just like you said,

versus just a word Like essential oils for sleep would be

a long tail keyword.

How many boards conservatively can someone start with?

So we actually get people doing this.

How many boards can you go up with and look significant

enough to start?

So I would say seven to 10 boards is a good

starting point.

Oh my gosh.

That sounds like a lot.

Well, I mean,

you could do less than that.

That's okay.

I mean,

even like five boards would be okay.

What's more important than the number of boards is the activity

on those boards.

So you want to be able to create boards that you

can consistently create content to Fewer boards.

Like, so think to yourself what you'll be able to do,

do fewer boards,

like five,

if you'll be able to continually put content in those boards.

Right. And I think like what we've talked about earlier,

let's say you have one blog article,

the wording in your post could be different bases on a

different point of that blog article or something so that it

could fit into different boards.

Right? Exactly.

So it doesn't have to feel so overwhelming And encourage people

to have kind of semi overlapping boards.

So one might be essential oils for sleep and relaxation and

then another one could be lavender essential oil.

And so if you have a blog post about lavender essential

oil and all the uses,

it could go in the lavender essential oil board and it

could go into the essential oils for sleep and relaxation.

So it can cross over different boards.

You don't have to have one content for one board.

It's good to be able to have a little bit of

overlap so that you can spread your content on a more

boards and potentially get in front of more eyes that way.

Okay. But when you say that,

can it be the exact same wording in the exact same

image that leads to the exact same article?

Or should they be different or it can be either way

mix and match.

That would be,

I don't know if we'll get into talking about tailwind or

anything like that,

but if you're creating a pin and you want to schedule

it to multiple boards,

it can go to multiple boards.

But what you need to do is make sure you space

them out a little bit.

So the first one might go out today to whatever the

most relevant board would be.

So if it is about lavender essential oil,

put it in lavender essential oil first because that's the most

specific relevant board to that content.

And then maybe five to seven days later,

it'll pin that pin again or you'll schedule it if you're

using a scheduler to the next board,

which might be the essential oils for sleep or relaxation.

So that same pin,

same picture,

same URL.

Everything's the same,

but just goes to the next sport.

It's basically duplicating it as a copy and putting it in

on another board.

Some people will find it through that board versus the first

one, but it's really important for that first pin to be

on a more specific board.

So it wouldn't just go into essential oils would be your

board and say,

you wouldn't want to just put it in there because that's

so broad.

There's so many essential oils.

And if someone's searching for lavender essential oil,

it may not show up in search results as high as

it would if it's in a board titled lavender essential oil.

Okay. So your best board first.

Really? Exactly.

Yep. Okay.

So speaking with a new person,

create the account,

think of who your ideal customer is.

And then you make content for boards that is information that

they are going to want to know about somewhere between on

the low end five.

And maybe if you have enough ideas up to 10 boards

to get started,

and then I'm thinking,

okay, again,

this account is brand new.

How many pieces of content should be in each board as

you're kicking off as you're getting started?

So again,

there's that like a set number of pins to having a

board you'll see,

sometimes people will say have 10 pins and a new board

people board secret until you have at least 10 pins.

You don't have to do that.

You can create a new board.

What's important is do start to add content to it right

away because the more content you have in it.

So say you have five to 10 pins in it that

are really specific and align perfectly with that board.

As far as that board is about it,

don't tell Pinterest,

it gives them clues as to what that board is about.

So when someone's searching for something along those lines,

Pinterest knows,

oh, I know where some of this content is.

It pulls that from your board and shows it to them.

So this is where if you're starting out and don't have

a lot of content where it's okay to repin other people's

content, make sure you're picking high quality content,

go into their website and making sure it's not like a

spammy website because you'll come across that on Pinterest sometimes.

But pin content that you know is super relevant to that

board. So you can tell Pinterest what that board is going

to be about.

And then as you start having your own blog posts or

your own products,

you can start creating content and just kind of switch over

to just putting your own content in there when you have

enough. Perfect.

Okay. And this leads to the point of what the content

is. And you just said it,

you know,

if you're doing a blog article,

then you can take that article,

think of what it speaks to in relation to the boards.

So that could be three,

four or five pins right there,

depending. And then products also,

what do you say about directly product selling on Pinterest?

It's a little bit harder.

If you have a shop on your website and whether it's

Shopify or any of those other shopping platforms,

you can set up a shop tab on your Pinterest.

So it's a little more advanced level here,

but that would be what you'd want to strive for is

to get that shop tab set up.

Because that way you can have your catalog of products will

automatically be fed in like an RSS feed almost to your

Pinterest shop tab.

So people will be able to see the up-to-date pricing and

availability and things like that.

And then you can use it for creating shopping ads and

things. But if you don't have a shop tab set up

yet, that's okay.

You can create boards.

And if you have various categories of products,

those could all be different boards and you can have a

one all encompassing,

you know,

whatever your shop name is or the products that would be

one board.

And then maybe you'd have another board with a sub category

of products and so on.

And then you can just create a pin,

design it in Canva or Photoshop or whatever you like using

create a pin,

upload it onto Pinterest.

Or if you're using a scheduler like tailwind at a title,

nice keyword,

rich title description about the product,

and then link it to that product page URL.

And then that would essentially create a product pin for you.

It wouldn't be the technically the same as that shop tab

product. It won't have the up-to-date pricing and stuff showing up

on it,

but it still functions the same.

If someone clicks it,

it'll go to that product page.

Okay. Wait,

what do you mean?

It wouldn't have the same up-to-date pricing.

If you going to a product on your website.

I mean,

it wouldn't show the price on Pinterest,

like in the title.

Whereas the shop tab does show pricing on your Pinterest account.

So make sure if you are creating manual pins for products

and you plan on changing prices ever,

don't put any price on the pin image just in case

he ever changed it.

Cause those pins are evergreen.

Once someone saves a pin,

it creates a copy of it.

And then if someone saves from their board,

it creates another copy and it just spreads like that.

And if you delete a pin from your account,

there's still copies out there that can be saved.

And reshared so that's another reason why deleting pins is pointless

because they're always going to live on if someone saved one

to their own boards.

So just make sure you're not putting any sale pricing on

a pin image.

Okay. So if you're linking to a product that's on your

website, make sure you don't put any pricing there because when

they link over to your website,

then they'll get the updated and correct price.

But then if you are using a shop tab on Pinterest

that will pull in the correct price,

if it's linked properly.

Yes. Makes sense.

Cause it'll pull the call,

your data,

feed it,

refreshes your catalog will refresh every day.

So, so it'd be up to date.

Got it.

A couple more final questions because we could go on for

hours. Like I could literally take up your whole afternoon Cali.

Oh no.

It's so easy to talk about.

Okay. Widgets.

What are widgets?

Yeah. Which is,

you know,

they don't get talked about a whole lot,

but they're so fun.

So the Pinterest and the I'm trying to remember,

it's been a little while since I set one up,

if you just Google Pinterest widget,

I'm sure the content will come up for it.

But basically if you have an iPhone,

well, I have an iPhone.

So I'm not really sure how Androids work,

but on your iPhone,

how you can create widgets,

which is almost like a bigger,

more prominent app or you know,

like button or whatever.

I don't know how you'd describe it.

So a Pinterest widget they've created their own that they have

now where you can select the size.

If you want it to be like,

take up the space of what four little icons would have

been or a half screen or whatever you want it to

be, you choose the size and then you can choose the

category. So on my phone,

I have a few of them.

I was just telling Sue about the quote one this morning.

So I have one on one of my pages on my

iPhone. I have the Pinterest widget that takes up like half

the screen.

And it pulls a random quote.

Every time I turn on my phone,

it's like a different one.

And it's just pulling pins from Pinterest.

And they're really pretty,

very aesthetic as people have their aesthetic I-phones and things like

that. But quotes is one you can have home decor,

even have recipes.

And I feel like maybe there's a beauty or skincare might

be another one and you can have multiple widgets.

So that each time you open your phone,

you see like a gorgeous recipe shot,

like just,

you know,

some food and it looks delicious.

Like right now I have one that's it looks like a

smoothie bowl or something.

It looks amazing.

It's got berries in it.

And then I have a home decor one,

which just,

I don't know.

But so what happens is if you click on it,

it'll take you to that pin and right into Pinterest.

So it's just a fun way to spice up your phone

screen. But the quote once is my favorite.

But so like my goal would be to show up in

one of those widgets,

right. That would be the ideal thing to do,

but it's a little bit newer and I haven't really dug

into the engineering side,

the technical side of it on how it works and what

it pulls through because they pull out very specific.

Looks like none of them are pins with words,

except for the quote one of course,

but like the room ones and the recipes,

it's just like a beautiful high quality photography image.

So I'm not sure where they're pulling those through.

If they have a list of content,

creators that they use,

this is a little bit newer,

so more to come on on how to get on there.

All right.

So we'll need an update from you,

Kelly. Absolutely.

I will dig into that one,

but it's fun.

But like the first thing to do with a situation like

this, regardless if it's a Pinterest widget or something else is

to analyze,

what's showing up and to make your content look similar,

like in terms of high quality photography or whatever,

and then be putting content like that up there.

That is the stuff that's being pulled in.

Cause maybe yours could be,

it's kind of like a real going viral,

like analyze and look and think through,

well, why is this one showing up versus other pins I've

seen? And how can you create something that might match or

give you an opportunity?

Cause that's huge visibility if that were to happen.

Oh, big time.

Well, and there is actually kind of a long those lines

on your Pinterest app and they slightly changed the interface.

But if you have the most up-to-date Pinterest app on your

phone, when you open it up and click on the search

icon, like you're going to type something in it's showing you

a lot of content before you even searched something.

So it's showing today's inspiration,

it'll show ideas from creators,

which are the idea pins.

It shows one of the newest things,

which is Pinterest TV,

where people can like do live show.

That's like really brand new live TV type stuff.

And then there's different spotlights on just key words and things.

I see It.

I'm looking at it right now.

So you can actually get featured on this.

It used to be called the today tab.

Then I don't think they call it anymore,

but where it's showing today's inspiration and then the ideas from

creators in order to be highlighted on their featured on there,

there is a link and it's like a super long link.

It's not like an easy one.

I could just read off to you,

but there is a link if you join on the Pinterest

creators community.

So I think it's creators.pinterest.biz.

So if you have a business account,

this is a free Pinterest forum.

This was going to be in my like resources I was

going to share.

So I'll go ahead and share it.

Now it's a free community for Pinterest creators.

So business owners who use Pinterest for marketing,

and when you're on there,

they will share each month the submission form,

where you can submit your content.

They'll tell you what the themes are because it has to

align with their themes and you can submit your content for

review. So basically you're submitting a pin like whether you created

an idea pin or whatever format opinion made,

if it fits with what their content is going to be

featured for the next month,

you can submit it in this form and they can randomly

pick it.

And my content usually doesn't fit in there.

So I've never been picked.

Cause marketing has never highlighted.

It's always food and things,

crafty stuffs,

Right. Which falls right in line with us.

So that's perfect.

So you guys should try it.

So that's a fun thing.

So you can get featured on there,

which is,

that would be really exciting.

And again,

it's, I was just going to read it's community.pinterest.biz.

So when you have your business account,

you can get signed up in there.

It just links your business account.

And it's just a Pinterest forum.

And you'll find that content in there for this featured tab.

Good. So as we're winding down here,

I know we talked about tailwind.

So let's talk about that.

And then any other resources you think we should know about

for this show?

Cause clearly I Think you're going to have to come back

oh my gosh.

Yes. I'd be happy to do that because so much to

cover. So I do recommend tailwind as a pin scheduler.

So it just helps for productivity.

The way it works is it's a Pinterest approved partners.

It's a separate from Pinterest,

but they're connected.

You connect your Pinterest account.

And then when you're creating pins,

they have some creative tools on there you can use to.

So whether you create your pins in Canva and upload them

onto tailwind to schedule them to your boards,

or you create using their tools,

you just create your pins,

put in your titles,

your links,

everything like that.

And then you can schedule them.

It's like a set and forget it.

So you schedule them to the boards that you want it

to go to.

And it will like,

you don't have to be as specific as putting in like

each day and time you want it to,

it has a really smart algorithm thing that they've figured out

based on your account and when your pins are most active

and it'll create schedules for you.

So that's really fun.

So you just put in the day,

yeah. You just pick the first day.

You want it to go and it'll schedule out.

You know,

if you're pinning it to five boards,

it'll space those all out like five to seven days and

just let it go.

So you can have like a month,

two months,

three months of content scheduled out in one sitting.

So really,

really cool.

So tailwind highly recommend.

If you don't want to use tailwind,

they do have a free plan and it just limits how

many pins you can schedule,

but they're paid plan.

And then it gets around $9 a month or something,

or maybe 19.

I can't remember,

but I think it's about 200 a year.

So their paid plan gives you unlimited pinning,

gives you access to the creator tools,

there's analytics on there,

but I prefer the Pinterest native analytics.

So I don't use the tailwind ones that much.

And then there's also a thing called tailwind communities,

which they used to be called tailwind tribes,

but they're essentially like group boards that you can share your

content to so that other people can add it then to

their boards.

So that can be a whole other conversation we can get

into onto when communities that one we should save for sure.

But tailwind does have a lot of great features that you

can utilize for your strategy,

but Pinterest itself has a scheduler,

but it's just not,

it's a little clunkier.

It's not as robust.

It's more limited.

Any other resources you feel like we should know about right

at this juncture?

I mentioned the trend report.

That is a huge one.

If for planning your content and knowing which search terms will

show up higher.

So that's trends.pinterest.com.

And then for other resources,

I mentioned the community community that Pinterest is,

that's a great place to ask questions.

They're launching like a mentorship program,

kind of mentorship.

I don't know what,

like a,

I don't know,

I'm basically like a moderator.

They invited me in it.

So I'll be one of the mods for it.

Congratulations. Thank you.

Yeah. They're launching that in January or February.

I think so basically.

Yeah. You can ask your Pinterest questions or like,

Hey, if I'm having some glitchy issues what's going on and

other pinners can chime in or the moderators there's Pinterest employees

that chime in.

So that's a really cool resource and free of course.

And then just for any,

because as we know,

Pinterest is constantly changing and evolving.

My favorite up-to-date resources for that is obviously Pinterest itself.

They've got a Pinterest blog and a newsroom,

which they share stuff.

The tailwind blog is really good too.

And then Pinterest business on YouTube has some great videos as

well. Oh,

That's a good idea.

Well, tell us real quickly about the Halcyon hive in a

little bit more detail.

Yeah. So a lot of people ask how to pronounce it.

Is That wrong?

Did I do it Wrong?

No, you did it absolutely.

Right. I don't even know how people pronounce it,

but I didn't really think that through when choosing my name.

So my business name was really hard in the beginning to

choose and I,

my sister,

her brand and we're super close and her brand is saffron

avenue and she does web and graphic design,

like I said,

but like,

oh, it'd be fun since we're sisters and we're close if

it was like another street name type thing.

So I was just going to do that,

but I couldn't think of anything that was cute.

And then like,

well, you can always use my name,

but my name is Kelly waggy.

And it's like,

that's not very,

if I just tally people are gonna think California,

cause it's C a L I,

and then wedgie just,

isn't a fun business name.

So when I use my name and I'm like,

oh my gosh,

what am I going to do?

And I remember I lived in Austin,

Texas for awhile and there was a coffee shop that I

absolutely loved.

I think it was just called Halcyon.

And I was like,

I love that word.

Like it just,

the vibe of that word and everything.

And I looked it up and the meaning just means like

total calmness and peace.

And I was like,

yes, this word totally is like speaking to me because that's

the reason why I wanted to leave my job when the

hecticness was to have my own career where I can be

at peace and spend time with my family and all of

that that were just resonated.

So that was it.

And then hive.

I really,

I don't know.

I can't specifically remember why I chose that,

but I know the meaning behind bees and hive is productivity

and, you know,

just like teamwork,

it's just me on my team right now,

but eventually love to have a team,

but just like teamwork and working together and productivity,

all of that.

So just kind of having their kind of two contradictory terms,

like homing,

peace and productivity.

But when they work together,

you have a really perfect thing.

So that's kind of the meaning behind my name.

It really has nothing to do with marketing or anything.

And so what do you do in the house?

The healthy and hide?

So, oh,

the other reason why I picked that because I was going

to start with a lifestyle blog and I'm just not a

great writer,

so that just never really took off either.

But I,

when I got into the marketing,

like I said,

I wanted to do social media marketing,

but honed in on Pinterest.

And that's all I do now.

The Halcyon hive is exclusively Pinterest marketing strategy.

So I have some content I'm working on some courses so

that people can kind of DIY their stuff,

but I mostly offer services.

So I do strategy sessions.

I'll do account setup.

So if someone doesn't have the bandwidth to set up or

overhaul or optimize their account,

I do that.

And of course,

Pinterest ads I'll run campaigns for people.

And then I do have some free content and getting started

guide. I was going to mention if you're brand new to

Pinterest and getting set up,

I have a three day like an email series that goes

out. It's kind of like an e-course that helps you go

from first setting up your business account through doing your keyword

research and creating your board.

So everything we kind of talked about,

but a little more in depth.

Wonderful. And where would people go To find that?

So on my website,

so the Halcyon hive.com

it's slash Pinterest dash three dash day dash challenge.

So it's my Pinterest three-day challenge.

The easier route to get to it.

If you're on my website,

just go to my menu and to shop,

I do have a shop with some like Pinterest templates of

things, but it's under the courses it's free,

but it's under the courses category.

So it's right at the top of the page or Easier

way is to go to our show notes page where we'll

have all the links,

make it super easy.

Yeah. So many ways to get there.

Okay. Cause it sounds like it would be a really beneficial

resource for everybody.

Kelly, this has been amazing recovered,

so many new things,

things I still didn't know about.

And I feel like I've started to become educated on Pinterest.

So just goes to show you there's a lot to know.

And the reason why they're specialists like you focus totally on

a certain platform.

Thank you for having me take care of Kaylee.

You too.

Bye-bye bye Pinterest.

The more I learn,

the more I love this platform,

it's close to becoming my favorite and you heard Kelly say

it herself.

It was made and favors creators.

What more could you need to get active here next week?

The topic is all around being a problem solver versus a

product pusher.

Now what does that mean tune in next week to find

out, thank you so much for spending time with me today.

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Got a really fun post in there.

That's my favorite of the week.

I have to say where I invite all of you to

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