238 – How to Maximize Sales at Local Craft Shows with Sarah Smith of Southern Caramel

Gift biz unwrapped episode 238 I had been giving these caramels

out as Christmas gifts and birthday gifts and things like that

and people had been telling me you need to solve these

caramels. Attention.

Gifters, bakers,

crafters and makers pursuing your dream can be fun whether you

have an established business or looking to start one now you

are in the right place.

This is gift to biz unwrapped,

helping you turn your skill into a flourishing business.

Join us for an episode packed full of invaluable guidance,

resources and the support you need to grow your gift biz.

Here is your host gift biz gal Sue moon Heights.

Hi there,

it's Sue and thanks For joining me here today.

Just a couple of days before Halloween and all the scary

antics. I used to do an annual Halloween party for my

friends. It started when the kids were young and all of

them would go off trick or treating as a group and

the parents stayed back at the house and we had our

own fun.

I'd make my famous Chile and when the kids returned they'd

have something to but only outside where it wouldn't matter if

they were messy and they could compare their candy stashes and

race around and it was just such great fun.

I still do an annual party,

but it's morphed into more of a fall celebration now that

the kids are grown and out of the house,

but my Joey still shows up.

Some traditions just have to keep going.

I wanted to share that with you because we're entering into

the season filled with lots of traditions.

After all,

I've now started another tradition right here on the show.

A couple of weeks ago I announced the new past guest

spotlight where I share successes from previous guests.

Today's spotlight is on Nina from Raha baby.

You may remember her product peekaboo.

These are potty training stickers.

Her show was episode number one Oh seven way back in

parents magazine and she saw sales skyrocket as a result of

being in that publication.

She's also added two business building extensions onto her initial core

product of peekaboo.

One was by attending a head start conference to introduce her

brand to early childhood educators,

so this is a totally new audience for her product,

but completely aligned with what she offers and she also ramped

up her potty training consulting services.

Boy could I have used that years ago.

Sadly, Nina also faced some serious issues in her life.

Last summer her mom had a massive stroke and so she

went back home to Tanzania for almost six months.

Her business went on though to still have a successful year

and this could only happen because she had solid systems in

place. There are too many achievements to mention with Nina,

but I bring these up as an example of how your

business can grow and expand once you've set that initial traction

and you'll note Nina started with one very specific product.

She's also asked me to offer you a free 20 minute

phone consult.

If you're in the midst of potty training and you want

some guidance for information on that and all links to what

I just shared about Nina,

please reference the show notes page along with this episode.

Now, speaking of seasons and the fall,

our guest today has a product that fits right in caramels.

You're going to hear how an initial failure led to an

even larger opportunity,

and we also dig deep into participating in local shows.

So this could be craft shows or farmer's markets.

We get into lots of detail on how to get the

most out of them as you possibly can.

Are you ready?

Today? It's my pleasure To introduce you to Sarah Smith.

home with her newborn daughter and as her daughter grew,

so did the business.

The caramels are made from scratch using pure ingredients.

They're hand crafted,

hand cut,

and hand wrapped too.

Making the caramels in small batches allows them to maintain a

level of consistency resulting in a product that makes people say,

Oh my goodness.

And I have to say that's true because I tasted these

caramels just a few weeks back so I can give total

credit to that statement with a product that lends itself to

giving and sharing in the community.

Sarah considers it a joy to give back to many causes

with her time,

talents and financial support through the business.

When she's not working on Southern Carmel,

she's involved with various ministry opportunities focusing on leading and teaching

women and children.

She also loves to host events which stems from the same

foundation of giving that Southern Carmel is founded on.

Sarah, I am thrilled that you're here today on the gift

biz on wrapped podcast.

Thanks too.

I'm so happy to be here.

I really appreciate you inviting me on.

I can't wait to talk about your story,

but before we do,

I'd like for you to share with our listeners a little

different side of you and that is through what a motivational

candle would look like if you were to create one of

your own.

So help us understand your motivational candle by color and then

a quote or some type of saying that would be on

that candle.

Okay. I think the obvious choice for a caramel maker would

be to say that it smelled like urban Carmel or sea

salted caramel.

But I think I'm going take it a different direction.

I'm around those smells all day long and they certainly do

energize me.

But I love the color yellow.

It's my favorite color and when I see it,

it brings me joy.

That color itself energizes me.

So I think if I had a motivational candle and had

a chance to create one,

it would be yellow and it would probably have kind of

a, because it's yellow,

a citrus smell and scent that would energize me and get

me going for the day.

In terms of a quote,

I thought about this and it's really more of a song.

It's a kid's song,

but it's something I say mentally to myself every day in

the good times and in the bad times.

And it's a song that goes,

this is the day that the Lord has made.

I will rejoice and be glad in it.

And it's just a reminder to me when times are really

good and it's easy to be joyful,

to just celebrate those gifts that come through the business through

life. And also,

let's be honest,

in a business,

there's times when it's not always easy and you might have

a challenging day.

That's something that I tell myself,

like, this is the day that the Lord has made.

Just stop whatever's going on.

It's not that bad.

Rejoice, you're alive,

you're doing the things that you're called to do.

Be glad in that day.

So that's definitely something I tell myself when I have a

hard day is just that it's not that bad.

It's certainly,

it's tomorrow's going to be a new day and it's all

good. It's just something I kind of sing in my head.

So I think that would be the quote that would be

on my candle because it is something I tell myself multiple

times a day.

Very positive,

uplifting, and why not start your day in the best mood

that you possibly can and reset if you need to along

the way.

I guess I would.

Yeah. So Sarah,

take us back a little bit and I know you were

talking about,

and we have in the intro that you started Southern Carmel

as a way to stay home with your daughter,

but where did the whole idea come from that this is

what you were going to do to start a business?

Yeah, great question.

It stems from like your interest said from gifting,

and I used to give these caramels as gifts.

Now I did not have any background in the food industry.

My background was in the aerospace industry and I,

I worked on project management type work for the space industry

here in Florida.

That's a big thing,

provides a lot of jobs and that was my background and

I had a regular nine to five job,

great benefits,

and got to that stage in life where I wanted to

start a family and I really wanted to be able to

stay home with my child at the time.

Didn't know if it was a boy or girl and had

started thinking about ways to do that and I had been

giving these caramels out as Christmas gifts and birthday gifts and

things like that and people had been telling me you need

to sell these caramels for about a year or two.

And I always told him,

I'm not going to my day job.

I have a really good thing going here and entrepreneurship is

not for me.

I like the corporate world and the security that it provides

me, but fast forward to desires changing and wanting to be

home with my daughter and I got that idea in the

back of my head on making the caramel and that's when

I started the business.

year or two to develop the recipe,

craft a business plan.

I had been selling them to different craft fairs and things

like that before she was born.

And then shortly after she was born,

I put in my notice and stayed home with her.

And I'd like to say the caramel business was my full

time job at that point.

But I was a little optimistic on what I could handle

with being a first time mom.

So it was very slow growth with the business that first

year. And I started from my home kitchen.

So I worked under the cottage food law here in the

state of Florida.

And when she was in bed I would make the Carmel

and cut and wrap it at home.

And at that point it was just myself and we had

something once a month here called Friday best.

And that was my first way to get out in the

community and sell the caramels directly to the public.

And people started telling me,

you should sell these to grocery stores and things like that.

And I started doing my research on what that would take.

And in the state of Florida,

that's not something that can be done from a home kitchen.

Even if you were inspected,

it needs to be a commercial kitchen and you needed to

be state inspected.

So in order to grow my business and have that wholesale

option also be able to sell online,

I would not be able to sell online in my home

kitchen. That was a rule in Florida.

So I started looking around to sublease kitchen space.

Again, still really young child at home and I didn't want

to take the overhead of my own full kitchen.

Okay. I'm going to stop you here just for a second

because I have a number of questions and I know there

are so many people who are listening right now who can

totally relate to what you just said.

Your story up to this point maybe about having a daughter

and that being the reason to change,

but I'm specifically talking about they make something and people are

saying to them,

this is so beautiful.

This is so delicious.

You know,

depending on your product,

you should sell it.

At that time,

did you believe them or did you think,

Oh well they're just being nice.

It's nice,

it's complimentary.

That's wonderful.

But at what point did you really start seriously thinking,

Hey, maybe this is something,

I think it was the more that people tried it that

didn't love me.

So you really knew their comments weren't just because you were

already friends or family,

Right? You've got friends,

you've got family,

you already know they love you,

they like you.

Of course they'd be honest maybe.

But when I started to sample the caramel in the community

with complete strangers and people would say things like,

this is the best caramel I've ever had,

or these tastes just like my grandma used to make.

I've tried her recipes so many times and I just can

never figure it out.

And that comment kept coming up over and over again of

just this expression of,

I've tried to make this before and I can't.

I burn it.

It's too soft.

It turns back to sugar.

All the things that I had experienced myself when fine tuning

the recipe.

But once I realized that this wasn't cookies and things like

that, anybody could make a cookie.

But you have to really differentiate yourself.

And at once I realized that not everybody can make a

Carmel or not everybody has the patience to hand wrap every

single piece and package it up in a larger quantity.

That really started to give me the thought of,

okay, this is something outside of what people could expect.

This is a viable business.

Not everybody could do it,

but also you had some type of a flavor or some

type of a mystery method or secret or something that people

were willing to strive for,

like they really wanted it and weren't able to achieve it

themselves. So you saw the need out there and the interest,

I guess.

Exactly right.

I don't know if anyone needs Piramal,

but I would kind of,

I do.

I'll go with that.

It's one of those things.

People sometimes come to us and say,

Oh, can you make a sugar-free Carmel?

And I'm sure there's a market for that.

I know there's a lot of people that have health concerns,

diabetes, and I always tell them,

we're not a health brand.

We do make everything with pure ingredients.

We don't use corn syrup or anything like that.

So we do strive to make the purest caramel you can

get, but it's all about just bringing a little bit of

joy into somebody's life.

And I'm sure many of the listeners here with being in

the gift industry,

that's what it's about.

I mean,

that's really what this Carmel is.

It's not saving lives.

And your dietician is not going to say,

Jason, you need more Carmel in your life.

But it puts a smile on people's face when they bite

into it.

They haven't had anything like it and it's just a small

indulgence in their day.

Well, I would say a psychologist might say,

yeah, you need more caramel cause it's gonna make you happier.

I couldn't go with that.

But you just brought up a really important business point here

too, is that you're really staying in your lane.

I mean,

you know what you're standing for.

You're standing for traditionally made Carmel,

not sugar-free.

And I really,

really appreciate and love that you're sharing that people have asked

you for something else and it would be so easy just

to sway,

say, Oh,

we need to have that to stay relevant because the market's

going to more healthy,

tight, Hooten free,

all these crazy things.

Right, but you've said,

no, you've put your foot in the sand.

What does it stick in the sand?

I'm not sure what it is.

Is your Mark in the sand,

let's say that says,

no, this is what we stand for.

This is what we make,

and I think you're going to be more successful for it

as you're already seen because you're standing for a specific thing.

Absolutely, and to be honest,

one of the things that sets our Carmel apart,

like I said,

sugar is the main ingredient,

but we do use pure ingredients,

many caramels on the shelf use corn syrup where we've gone

out of our way to fine tune a recipe that doesn't

use corn syrup.

In fact,

the very first caramels I ever made had corn syrup in

them. But as time went on and I could share a

little bit more about that with you later,

it became evident that that was not the best thing for

us. That we really needed to find a way to make

them without corn syrup.

And it differentiated us from other caramel makers out there.

And there's not many that don't use corn syrup.

And if you look at the ingredient label on a lot

of the caramels on the shelf,

there's a much longer list than sugar cream and butter.

So that is one thing that yes it is sugar,

it is a sweet,

but we've managed to make it without a bunch of additives

and preservatives that also aren't good for you.

Okay, so you said there's a story behind it.

So let's go there because I don't want to forget about

it later.

Sure. So one of the,

should I say roadblocks when starting the business and as time

went on with the Carmel was our shelf life.

So you make something at home and it doesn't matter what

the shelf life is because you're going to sell it at

a market and they're going to eat it right there and

no big deal.

But as we grew into a wholesale market,

and I alluded to it earlier,

but that was when I started a kitchen sharing situation.

So that was kind of middle of our story was I

went from a home kitchen to subleasing a bakery,

a really sweet woman,

let me use her bakery on Sunday and Monday when she

was closed.

So we had our state inspection.

Now I was able to sell to local grocery markets and

I was able to sell online and I made it the

same way I always did.

And it lasted for about six weeks.

And I was putting them in the grocery stores and many

of them looked at me and said,

we can't do anything with six weeks and we can't sell

a whole case worth in six weeks,

but let's try it.

And like I said earlier,

we live in Florida,

we live really close to the beach and a lot of

our high end grocery markets are on the beach,

which have really high humidity and our caramels who are sitting

on the shelf and they were crystallizing within two to three

weeks. Oh no.

Yeah. So something that was always smooth and creamy and great.

We're getting phone calls.

I say it was me,

you know,

I was getting phone calls that the Carmel was turning back

to sugar and they wanted their money back and they couldn't

sell it.

And I was like,

Oh, what do I do?

I mean the whole reason it tastes the way it does

is the recipe.

And at that point you never used corn syrup,

is that correct?

No, I had been using cortex.

So you had been using corn syrup.

Okay. So this was your initial recipe,

if you will.

Right. Beginning stages.

Yep. All right.

So I could see people at this point saying,

Oh my gosh,

I'm a failure.

This isn't gonna work.

I'm done.

Exactly. It doesn't sound like that's what you did.

No, not at all.

It was hard.

I mean,

because it was in the course of a week that I

had three or four different Mark.

I mean it was happening to everybody and the people that

were on the beach,

it was happening much faster.

So we went back to the drawing board and I was

kind of tweaking and I have this little composition notebook that

every recipe I test I would tweak it and change some

things here and there.

And that's when I started playing with making the caramels without

corn syrup.

And I'm not going to go into too much detail there

because that is part of what sets us apart from our

competitors. But we weren't able to make it without the corn

syrup. And a happy byproduct of that was that people now

liked the fact that it didn't have corn syrup.

So the driving force was my shelf life.

It had nothing to do with corn syrup versus non corn

syrup. It had to do with the shelf life and not

being able to have a recipe that would last for weeks.

So once we made the tweak,

our shelf life is now 16 weeks.

So four months.

Perfect. Oh my gosh,

that's so great.

So here's a perfect example though of turning a real problem,

not only correcting it,

but turning it in to your favor.

Right? Absolutely.

It was an act,

I won't say it was an accident.

It was a problem that needed to be solved for the

shelf life reason,

but it ended up putting us in even a better place

because we're one of the few caramels out on the market

that don't use corn syrup.

And do you promote that in your marketing?

Yes, we do.

And are there health benefits to not using corn syrup or

just makes for a different product or how do you promote

it? What's the messaging?

Many people,

I won't say most,

but many products out there that use corn syrup.

They're using high fructose corn syrup and they really aren't putting

any distinction versus corn syrup and high fructose corn syrup.

And we all know that high fructose corn syrup is not

the best for us.

So people,

even if it's not high fructose,

even if it's just corn syrup,

because there is a difference,

people still have a negative connotation when they hear corn syrup

now. So that is one thing to,

as soon as we say,

Oh, we don't use corn syrup for our caramels,

people immediately,

Oh really?

You know?

It's like,

Oh, I'll buy it now.

I'm guessing they also then want it Taste it like,

Oh you not,

then what are these caramels even tastes like?

And then they get the,

Oh my goodness reaction,

right when they've tasted it and they're so delicious and one

thing leads to another.

So just the fact you don't use corn syrup,

I would guess,

peaks the curiosity when you're in a situation where you're sampling

the product.

Absolutely. And it helps to where it doesn't stick to your

teeth. That's another thing with caramel,

a lot of times you bite into a caramel and you've

got to kind of pick at your dental work to make

sure you're not pulling something out.

Your dentist is angry with you.

Right. But one of the best compliments we get is when

people are hesitant to try it because they're like,

Oh, I don't like caramel.

It always sticks in my teeth.

It's really not my thing.

And maybe their friend next to them is like,

no, really,

you gotta try these.

These are the best things ever.

And so they'll hesitantly try one because they're expecting it to

do what every other caramel does and stick to their teeth.

And then their eyes just light up and they're like,

Oh, this not only just tastes amazing,

but it's just this smooth,

creamy caramel that doesn't stick to my teeth.

Yup. And delicious.

I have to say,

once again,

I'm so glad you like them.

Love them.

Well, I like Carmel anyway,

and so now I've just upped my game.

I have a different level now when I'm analyzing Different appreciation.

Yeah, for sure.

And so with the absence of the corn syrup,

then I'm guessing that you're able to get shelf placement where

others can't.

So you end up being kind of alone in the category,

being able to be the caramel that wholesalers can stock specifically

because of the warm environment,

et cetera.

Exactly, and there are a few stockists that have requirements for

their ingredient list.

Some grocery stores,

canes, that they have a list.

Any of our products have this ingredient in it,

we cannot sell it.

And there's a few that we've made it into their stores.

That corn syrup is one of them.

So I guess one that over some others vendors because they

would have that ingredient.

Yeah, taking advantage of an opportunity that you have in the

market in that way.

For sure.

So question for you on the stores that came back to

you and said,

we can't sell this,

we need to take it off the shelf.

You went back,

adjusted the recipe,

et cetera.

Did you re approach those stores then saying I've got a

different product now.

I did.

And there was one that did not want to continue their

relationship, but to be honest,

everybody else was willing to give us a second try.

And we did a lot of samplings,

a lot of demos where we would come in with that

new product and sample it and once they saw that they

could keep it on their shelf for four months now and

that they were moving the product within that time,

they were happy.

We were happy,

we were seeing reorders.

So you know,

like I said,

there was one,

and I understand that right when you're starting out,

sometimes something like that happens and it's a sign that you're

still very much a starter business.

You're not ready for this.

There's things you haven't considered.

We don't want to mess with this product right now.

And I could understand that at that time and grown a

lot since then with our inspections and labeling,

we've continued to grow out of that.

But looking back at that point,

we were very bare bones and it was a risk for

some people to try us.

And when they had that negative experience,

we didn't pick up that one store.

But like I said,

everybody else,

we live in a great local community and everybody was willing

to give us a second shot.

And really that was so early on.

Many of our accounts,

don't know.

That's part of our history.

They just know that we have an amazing Carmel without corn

syrup that lasts on their shelf for four months.

Right? But I'll tell you,

I mean every single company has something,

some barrier that they come up against,

and then it's up to you as the business owner.

Am I going to work through it?

How am I going to work through it?

And you get smarter as you go,

right? So if someone looks at you now they see your

product on the shelf,

or like I did,

I saw you at a show.

It's not like you jumped from nothing to all of a

sudden where you are now.

It's an evolution.

You get smarter,

you get wiser.

You get more sophisticated,

perhaps in your marketing,

your packaging,

et cetera,

to journey.

Absolutely. We're going to hear more from Sarah,

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Let's talk A little bit more about sampling.

I be curious in your expert opinion here,

and let me lay some groundwork regardless of the product that

a lot of our listeners have because it ranges all over

the board.

Right? One of the things that a lot of people will

do is test their product through craft shows.

Okay. And I guess I'm just,

it doesn't necessarily need to apply to consumable businesses only at

this point,

but I've actually been to some shows where people have an

edible product,

cookies or something like that.

They're selling at craft shows,

but they're not giving away samples at all,

which to me is like crazy.

That would seem to be the obvious thing.

But in your experience at shows and or sampling in stores,

is there any advice that you'd have any extra benefits about

sampling? Let's just talk a little bit about that.

Maybe to give our listeners some ideas of things that they

could be doing and applying when they're in a sampling situation.

Absolutely. And to be honest,

we've kind of been all over the map on this one

with our lessons learned on when it's worth it and when

it's not,

because it's an added cost,

right? Sometimes it's not just the cost of your product,

but it's the time to be there during the holiday season.

I'm the owner.

So if I'm there sampling,

it's no big deal.

But if I send somebody else now I have the labor

to pay them for however many hours of being there and

the cost of the product.

So cost is always something to consider.

And I think that's something that people don't look when they're

starting out.

When you've got a hobby business,

you're starting out at a craft show,

they don't think of all the expense that goes into sampling.

So say you're doing a craft show and you're doing a

demo or sample,

you've got cookies,

whatever it is,

you've got the costs to make those,

you've got your labor to be there.

So figure out what the going rate is in your area

of the country.

If you were to pay someone to market your product,

and I did that and tested central Florida with what other

demonstrators were making.

Wine demonstrations are always out in different marketplaces and so I'd

ask them what do you get?

And I understand that wine is different from some other things,

but it gave me a gauge for,

for labor specifically,

you're talking for labor specifically and then you've got the cost

of the event.

So if it's a craft show,

maybe you paid $40 for your table or whatever it is,

and then how much did you sell that day as a

result of your sampling?

In the beginning for what we had a consumable,

we're claiming it's the best Carmel ever.

Nobody in the world had ever heard of us.

We had to sample.

It's a premium product,

it's a premium priced product.

So people weren't going to pay that premium price and take

a risk on it if they didn't know how good it

was. So it definitely was beneficial in the beginning,

especially for our product because if they were going to pay

that much,

they needed to know it was worth that much.

It was,

I mean many people would try one and immediately say,

I want one for every employee in my office.

I'm going to take 10 home and give them to everybody

on Monday just to let them know that they're doing a

great job.

So once they tried it,

I would sell it.

And then you keep track of that in the beginning.

So whatever you're demonstrating or selling at that particular event,

try to figure out what your cost was to be there

to demonstrate and then what's your return on that?

Are you actually selling or getting orders or it can be

gauged differently.

I understand that for certain things,

you're not going to make a sale right there on the

spot, but maybe you made a really good contact and they

want to order from you around Thanksgiving.

And once that comes through you can see that there was

value in that sampling.

I will say as we grew,

everybody in the world wants you to sample.

If you're in the grocery market,

specialty food type thing,

they want you to be there every weekend sampling.

And when we were first getting into stores,

we did a lot of that and then we were spending

so much money sampling that we were still getting returned.

I mean we were still getting reorders from those stores,

but it got to a point that it was like,

Oh my goodness,

we are spending so much money doing these demonstrations.

How can we reevaluate this?

And depending the setup of the customer,

we have tweaked that over the years where maybe now if

we set up a new wholesale account,

we can include complimentary product for the first opening order and

we'll send some nice marketing material,

printed flyers that they can put up in their store on

their shelf and let people know that it's a new product

if it's in Florida,

that it's locally need and then they are doing the sampling

and we're not sending someone out because sometimes as we're growing,

these places are,

are a four hour drive away.

I mean,

it's not like they're in our County anymore.

So as you grow it definitely reaches a point where the

expectation is that you sample and it's kind of like we

could go broke trying to sample everywhere and then you might

need to tweak it.

That was probably more than you wanted to know.

That was a long answer Was a great answer.

And I think particularly for your situation,

because your ingredients are different,

you want people,

I mean it's to your benefit that people are sampling and

trying it because they have an assumed taste that they're going

to have when they put your caramel in their mouth and

then it's different,

right? We were just talking about how it could stick to

your teeth,

it's whatever.

And all of a sudden people see,

no, this is different,

this is something special,

and they're not going to know that unless you sample.

So I think in a way,

depending on your product,

you have to do that.

If you're new to the market,

at least to start getting some footing going.

I'm also thinking,

and I don't know if you did this,

Sarah, and you might not have had to,

I don't know the cost structure that you have,

but apart from the labor,

your product,

if your product is really expensive,

maybe you make pieces that are smaller so you're not giving

a whole Carmel,

maybe you're giving a half a caramel,

you know,

just to cut down on product costs.

Again, Sarah,

that might not apply to you.

It's just an idea for some of our listeners.

Yeah, absolutely.

Let's say you make big huge Mongo cookies,

right? Like that's your thing.

Maybe you're going to break those cookies up.

Absolutely. Just to taste.

Yeah. Just to taste so,

and I really like what you're talking about here too,

in terms of as you move forward,

you're still providing the opportunity to sample,

but you're pulling out the labor portion for yourself,

right? Yeah.

So really smart move.

I also would suggest,

tell me if this was your experience,

that in the very beginning when you're sampling,

you also want to see customers' reactions,

how they're talking about it,

because you can get a lot of product information from your

customers, just observing how they're interacting and tasting your product.

Absolutely. If you start seeing,

like you say,

people were saying,

Oh my goodness,

right? That could even be something.

Then that carries on into promotional lines,

social media lines,

all that type of thing.

So, and it's not coming from you,

it's coming from your customers.

Absolutely. Some of the best testimonials come just that way.

You're standing across from that customer,

you're gauging their reaction.

They say something that is just said so succinctly,

and sometimes I'll say,

do you mind if I use that as a testimonial for

marketing purposes?

And they're like,

no, and I'll just take out my phone and write down

what they said and then use that for Instagram or something

else. But absolutely.

To just use that feedback for marketing purposes.

Yeah. And so how do you,

when you're sampling,

you talk about the fact that people aren't necessarily going to

buy right then and there.

They might,

you know,

if they're at a small show,

they might buy for their consumption right at the show,

but you're really getting the potential for larger orders later.

Right. How are you capturing contact information so that you can

stay in touch with them?

Great question.

So typically any time that we sample an event,

like a craft show or during the holidays,

there's always a lot of craft shows.

We always have an email signup out.

Now, one of the things that can be a little touchy

depending on the type of event that you're sampling at,

is if somebody else is hosting it and they've invited you

to come in,

or maybe it's a paid event,

it's a ticketed event where we've been part of just where

people can come and taste different foods of the area,

whether it's from a local community or even central Florida.

But people get a wristband and they get to come and

try all the different products.

We had something like that in our community.

Just this past weekend there was a big art festival,

but along with it was taste of Highland park,

so vendors would come in,

you could buy product,

but I think there was also sampling,

so like taste of the town type thing.

Something like that you mean?

Yeah, and like a food and wine festival.

We've been part of food and wine festivals where people pay

a decent amount of money to come in and get unlimited

food and wine and they have that wristband and you've got

to learn your different events.

Sometimes the expectation for the host of that event is,

look, these people have paid to be here.

They just want to eat,

drink, and be married.

We don't want you marketing.

We don't want you trying to get email addresses and you

basically you being here is your marketing,

Which means then it's the consumer's responsibility to get back in

touch with you.

You have no way of getting to them.

Right, Absolutely.

And to be honest,

you've got to gauge on whether those are worth it,

right? Because if you're just giving out product to people,

it's on them to come seek you out and find you.

Maybe that's not the best event,

but I have found as time has gone on the way

events are structured with sampling and kind of,

I know email sign up is typical at events like that

where either you have an iPad out where they can sign

up or just a printed sheet where they give your email

address. There's definitely events that are structured in a way where

that is frowned upon and sometimes that's okay.

Sometimes maybe the host of the event would give an email

list afterwards,

which is very generous and always appreciated and then you don't

have to worry about email capture during the event.

And then there's other times that maybe it's a really upscale,

high-end event.

It is good to be there even though you're not permitted

to do email capture or things like that.

Even sometimes just getting business cards for those,

like we have one event here in town.

It's really,

really high end and there's just a lot of business owners

in the community,

a lot of doctors and lawyers and different people that put

on Gallas and as many of the listeners here in the

gift industry and come Christmas time,

you're looking for those corporate people to connect with.

A lot of times,

even if I can't get an email capture,

it's, Oh,

you love these and you own XYZ business.

Can I have a business card?

I would love to follow up with you after this event

and just see if we can help you out with your

holiday gifts this year and then that way it's a really

nonthreatening way to where you're making connection through that event,

but it's not as gimmicky as signed here.

Right. What do you think of doing some type of a

raffle at your table booth,

whatever it is,

or including your business contact information with the product?

Raffles are great.

I love raffles.

And that's something I usually ask if I'm doing an event,

if they haven't advertised that we're allowed to do them,

I'll ask like,

can you,

do you mind if I do a raffle for,

we have a sampler box where people can try four different

flavors of caramel and then people could drop in their card,

either a business card,

if it's that type of event,

or they can fill out a card with email address,

phone number,

name, things like that.

And that's a great way to entice people to give their

contact information.

So I'm a big fan of that.

Right. And some people won't because they know exactly what's going

to happen.

You know that they're going to be followed up with an

email. Yeah,

yeah, they can unsubscribe.

Exactly. So I think the lesson here might be just keep

this top of mind and for any event that you're doing,

find out what the rules are for an event.

And sometimes you're not going to be able to do anything.

That's fine,

but you don't want to be in a position where later

you say,

dang, I could have gotten an email addresses and I didn't.

Right. That's not as great.

And then analyzing afterwards how valuable the event was in terms

of what's happened,

new customers,

new prospects in the case of potential corporate client.

Right. Cause you only need one huge corporate client or even

medium size for an event to have been completely worthwhile.

Absolutely. One other thing I like to do after an event,

so whatever email address is I captured from that event,

I'll go back the next day or if it was on

a Friday,

I might wait until the following Monday and I will just

send an email through my marketing hub that I use and

I typically do not discount,

I'm not a discount brand,

but I like to track if those people will be spending

with us.

So that is an example where I might give a discount

code for just those people that just subscribed and I'll have

a code specific to that event and they might get 15%

off and it's only good for three or four days.

Like they have to use it right away.

But it's enough that I can track like,

Oh, not only did I pick up email addresses,

but I just picked up new customers that will consistently keep

buying from me.

Right. Okay.

So this is going to be an interesting question.

Okay. Hundred percent agree with you.

I agree with you also on discounts,

but coding the discount so you can see who's coming back

as a great way to track what events are working.

So every event has a different code.

Exactly. Okay,

so let's say you just did an event last weekend,

you come back,

you have emails from people who however you attracted those emails,

you send them out a promotion.

Thanks for sampling our product,

whatever you're going to say,

and you give them a code.

Some people take the code and buy a product,

at which point they've turned into a customer,

so now they can be on your customer list,

you can promote to them as a customer.

What do you do then with those people who did not

take advantage of the discount Up till now?

They do stay on my distribution list,

but I personally don't send out like a followup blast if

you will.

I know of some that do that,

like they'll track who made a purchase and who didn't and

they'll send up a followup blast to like,

Hey, we missed you.

I never get rid of email addresses.

I think I've heard of one person that actually does most,

don't never get rid of any email address,

but I still keep them on my distribution list and again,

if they're not interested then they don't have to subscribe.

Okay, so you'll continue emailing them and then they can always

unsubscribe, which legally you have to do just in case.

Some of our listeners don't know that if you're ever sending

out something to customers,

you have to have a way.

Usually it's an unsubscribed button at the bottom that most email

providers really easily just integrated with their systems.

So, but you have to absolutely do that.

Some people who aren't going through a true email provider,

you're just sending out an email,

let's say through a list of emails,

like you're still using just Gmail to send out just a

random list.

Then what people will do is they'll stay,

if you're not interested in receiving these emails,

reply with unsubscribe in the subject line or something like that.

But just an aside.

Yeah, that's a great comment for people that might still just

be using their email to do that.

But another wonderful reason on why,

even if you only have a hundred names,

it's great to switch to an email marketing service and there's

MailChimp. They're free.

And I know a lot of people use that one.

It's MailChimp to start and then we've since switched.

And what are you using now?

We are using mad Mimi.

What is mad Mimi?

M I M I Mad Mimi.

Yeah. That's interesting.

I've not heard of that one.

I have to go check them out.

Yeah, we like it.

And one of the reasons,

again, you kind of learn your demographic and where you're at

because a lot of our email,

well, a lot of our emails are captured through our website

now, which those are coming nationally.

Those are coming from all over the country,

but specifically if we're doing an event,

a local event,

we know that in our County that MailChimp does not deliver

to aol.com

or a CFL done our.com

it will get kicked back.

So personally,

because working with our web developer,

we know where we live and we know where the bulk

of our subscribers are coming from and the fact that goes

emails do not get delivered.

That was why we switched to MadMimi,

but again,

that wouldn't necessarily apply to everybody everywhere they lived it just

for whatever reason in central Florida,

that's how it works.

Got it.

Well, an email is a topic unto itself,

but I think the real point here is you should be

using an email provider,

MailChimp, constant contact MadMimi now I'm going to add to my

list. Yeah,

it's a little cheaper.

There are a number of them out there.

They're not expensive.

Many of them will allow you to use their systems for

a list up to a certain number of contacts.

Maybe it's 500 maybe it's a hundred I don't know.

They're different for different people,

so we've definitely something to check out if you're still doing

it, just yourself.

There are a lot of reasons to be doing it that

way, so.

Okay, wonderful.

Taking you back to your kitchen,

when you landed the recipe,

that is your golden secret claim to Southern caramel fame.

How'd you like that?

That was great.

I liked that a lot.

Okay. What types of things do you have in place to

protect the recipe?

Well, right now I'm the only one that makes it,

so that's a big one.

That's intentional.

The knowledge lies only with you,

but Sarah,

what happens if you get sick or something happens?

Do you have it written down somewhere and put under lock

and key or something like that?

Yes. This has changed a little bit in the last year.

So when I first got the recipe to where it was

and we were still in the kitchen sharing situation,

I was the only one that made it and I was

the only one that knew how to make it.

So if anything happened,

then there went the recipe,

You're out of luck.

I will say at that stage in the game,

we were still very,

very small.

We were selling to stores,

but it was still,

I hate the term hobby business.

I feel like it's so belittling when you're trying to grow

something. I had a lot of coaches say,

Oh, it's just a hobby.

It's just a hobby business.

And I'm like,

well, I really am trying to grow this.

This doesn't feel like a hobby to me.

This is feels like I'm growing a business.

But I do understand that there are other people that for

them it is a hobby business for me.

The term has always had negative connotations,

but that's another thing for me,

it makes me look back and say,

Oh, just you,

wait, I'll be back to you.

Yeah, and that's kind of where we're at,

to be honest.

Yeah. I feel like there's some people I would love to

go back to now and say,

does it look like a hobby now?

But now I got lost on the question now that we

got on the side.

We were talking about the recipe like that is your golden

gem of the business,

right? That's the heartbeat of the business.

So we were talking about protection,

keeping it safe,

and I bring it up only because I think specially when

you're starting a business and you're starting to have people help

you because you're getting the bigger orders and you need help,

people may not pay attention to the fact that that needs

some protection and safety around it.

Yeah, absolutely.

So now that we're in a different situation,

a little over a year ago was a huge growth point

for Southern Carmel.

My dad joined me as a business partner.

Yay dad.

Yeah, exactly.

Yay. Dad Knight in shining armor.

It was a huge pivotal moment for Southern caramel because I

had a recipe,

I had a small base of accounts and I really needed

that business knowledge.

I mean I'm fairly young and I will fully recognize that

there's just a lot of things in life that I haven't

experienced yet.

Give it time.

I will.

But there's other people that have a lot of experience and

have gone through a lot of different businesses,

worked a lot of different aspects of different businesses.

And my dad is one of those Jack of all trades

who's done a lot of things and brought a lot of

knowledge to the table.

So I had kind of been teasing them for about a

year on like,

Oh, you need to quit your job and come help me

grow Southern Carmel.

And everything kind of worked out a little over a year

ago for,

he was at a point when he said,

okay, I will come and help you grow Southern Carmel.

And so now that he is on board,

I have shared the recipe with him.

So if I win the lottery tomorrow and walk away,

which I wouldn't,

he knows the recipe and he can make that and when

we moved into the kitchen than we're in now,

we stood side by side and he can make it if

I wasn't there.

And then we do have everything written down.

But it's kind of funny.

I purposefully,

not everything is written like all in one place,

if that makes sense.

Oh, I like that.

It's like a puzzle you got to know it is.

It's kind of all in one notebook.

But yeah,

I've kind of written it in a way that sometimes there's

measurements but not words because I know what the ingredients are.

So you might see like two and a half cups of

something, but you're like,

I don't know,

two and a half cups of what.

So if anybody found it and wanted to sell it for

a billion dollars,

they'd have to decipher it.

Got it.

Important. Just to recognize that that is the most important part

of your business.

It is the recipe and you want to protect,

especially as you grow,

as you get bigger and bigger.

And bigger,

you have employees who are coming in,

et cetera,

nondisclosure agreements,

noncompete, you know,

all that type of thing.

But that's not necessarily for today.

So. Alright.

How are you working towards the holidays now this,

I'm imagining it as a big season for you.

So what types of things do you start thinking about to

make the most of that opportunity as possible?

Yeah, great question.

Especially in this gifting industry as a whole.

I think many listeners can recognize that that started a couple

months ago,

right? Like we all kind of start planning for the holidays

in the summer.

I know the summer is slower for many businesses,

but for candy it's really slow.

So we've tried to structure our business in a way that

we have some form of revenue coming 12 months out of

the year,

even though we blow fourth quarter out of the water because

that is caramel season.

I mean,

everybody's got a brain,

but because summer is a little bit slower,

that always gives us an opportunity to really get ready for

the holidays and figure out which flavors we're going to offer.

Last year,

one of our holiday flavors was coffee,

which we ended up keeping year round.

Yeah. And there's a couple of flavors that were,

we made a decision on whether we were going to offer

those or not.

So fine tuning our holiday lineup on what we're going to

do for flavors and then starting to plan for packaging materials.

So for us,

our raw goods,

so we can only order as fast as we go through

them. We were a smaller setup so we don't have a

huge amount of storage plus the fact that half of our

ingredients are cream and butter,

you can't like store those forever.

Right. So for raw materials,

in terms of the ingredients,

we can consistently stay on top of ordering that through our

supplier during the holidays.

But like our boxes or packaging boxes that we use.

Not shippers,

not like something you'd send ups,

but like the actual packaging.

That's something that we've started planning for in ordering now,

and this is where it gets hard for a small business

because every year is better than the year before and fourth

quarter, every year is way better than the year before and

it's really hard to predict what we're going to sell because

we're picking up new customers every single year and not only

we're picking up new customers,

but new volume because as we're growing,

we're able to produce more than we ever have.

We just actually last week got a cutting machine and a

wrapping machine,

so something that's always been done by hand.

It's now automated to the fact that we can do more

volume than we have ever done before by light years and

it really opens up a lot of possibilities,

but we're trying to figure it out.

In fact,

we're still kind of having this conversation of what do we

need be ordering for the holidays for fourth quarter?

Because you're talking about specific holiday themed packaging.

Well, I see ours is a little bit different than many

other companies out there.

I think many listeners probably have holidays specific packaging that whoever

your supplier is,

you need to start ordering.

Our packaging has a lot of personal touches with stamping,

like hand stamping,

the flavor.

We hand tie all the string on our boxes and then

we have logo stickers.

So the way we differentiate our holiday packaging is simply with

a red string instead of a blue string that we normally

use and people adore it.

They love our packaging.

It's a just a Brown box with the red and white

candy cane string and it's really,

really simple.

But it's also something that our customers love.

So it's a little bit easier for us because it's not

like a printed candy Cade box or you know something was

Santa on it or something like that.

It's something that we differentiate with the color of the string.

So for us,

for planning purposes,

it's a matter of all of our boxes.

Like I already ordered our string for the holidays and I

just ordered like twice as much as we went through last

year. And then around October,

November, I might have more of a feel for what our

orders are going to look like and I might need to

place a second order.

Got it.

But again,

you got plan for that.

And to be honest,

last year,

again, a huge growth year for us.

It felt like we were constantly running out of stuff.

And we're in Florida,

one of our suppliers is in California,

one's in Ohio,

we've got stuff coming from all over the country and it's

not just the shipping time to get here,

but the lead time on some of those items and one

of our boxes,

it was on back order,

like the whole country,

what did this box and it just was on back order

over and over and over again.

So we kept ordering ahead of what we thought we would

need and we kept running out and we'd placed an order

in what we thought was enough time.

And then they're like,

Oh well this is on four week back order or six

week back order.

And I'm like,

well, I'm sitting on a couple of thousand of these,

but we're going to run out.

We need more.

Did you have a contingency plan,

like a second option box?

What do you do?

Have a contingency plan.

Fortunately, we never had to tap into our supplier was amazing

to work with and they actually were able to limit the

lead time on one of the line items like they worked

with us to where they cut two weeks off and we

did work with one of our customers that was ordering thousands

a lot.

We were able to push it out like a week and

that combined with the supplier working with us,

we were able to meet the demand,

but it was close and everybody was getting rolled.

They're nervous and sweating.

Gotcha. Okay,

so it sounds like you're not having trouble getting customers,

that's for sure.

Especially with this whole Story around the holidays,

but what are you doing then promotionally or with brochures or

how are you getting the word out about your holiday line

to customers and also prospects?

This is one of those things I feel like we're probably

a little different from most companies that I'm talking to because

we are not putting a lot of money into promotional materials

and digital marketing and all of the things that it seems

like a lot of companies are investing in to get the

word out primarily because they cost a lot of money.

It depends on the product and the industry,

but we're still like really old school.

Just making a prospect list and picking up the phone and

calling or following up with emails and it's working.

I mean,

like I said,

in the age that we're in the digital age,

I kind of feel like it's almost stone age prospecting at

times because things are just done so differently now,

but to be honest,

we haven't had a ton of success when we try to

switch to,

Oh, we're going to put a ton of focus on Instagram

or Facebook or whatever it happens to be,

we're going to pay for all these ads and what we

end up having is a lot of ad dollars with not

a lot of customers.

I think it's still that personal touch,

but still the one on one and for a company to

reach out specifically sets you apart,

number one and shows that you really care.

And I'm guessing that you're prioritizing,

like you're starting with the biggest clients and getting them covered.

Make sure they're set and then just going down the list.

Yeah, absolutely.

Whether it's find a specific industry that pairs well with your

product and you've had success with one,

whether it's a hotel,

it's like,

okay, let's go after every hotel in the world.

Not really.

But if we have had success with hotels,

we just start calling sales managers at hotels and saying,

Hey, would you use our product for your sales team?

Would you put us in your sundry shop at the hotel?

And that's just one example of,

okay, we've found success here.

Let's continue going after more of these.

And who's doing that?

Is it you or it dad?

It's me and my dad.

The two of you.

Okay. And where we're at the point that we need a

sales team.

So we've kind of dabbled with a couple of things.

We did have a sales person that we had on contract

and didn't work out.

It was no harm,

no foul kind of thing.

They just didn't sell anything.

Well, you learn,

you learn how you're going to set it up and how

it's going to work.

Right? Right.

And I'm not trying to toot my own horn or anything,

but we sell really well because this is our baby,

this is our product,

and we can sell it better than somebody else.

But at the same point in the day,

we're also cooking and we're also wrapping it and we're boxing

it. We're the accounting and we're doing the events.

And I mean,

I know this is nothing new for everybody listening.

I mean you get to the point that you can't do

it all.

Yeah. So that'll be a new step in the future.

Absolutely. Wonderful.

Well, it's really exciting to catch you at this point,

at this stage in your development because you clearly have traction.

You're seeing success,

you have a product.

Absolutely. That has a unique market.

Your messaging is right on and it's exciting and there's so

much more growth opportunity moving forward.

So that's very exciting.

At this point,

let me offer you a virtual gift.

So this is a magical box of unlimited possibilities for you

with Southern Carmel or for you just personally,

it doesn't matter.

So it's your dream or your goal of almost unreachable Heights

that you'd wished to obtain.

Please accept this gift and open it right here on this

show. What's inside your box?

Okay, you're going to laugh,

but it's the person I'm ready key.

It's something that we'd love really,

really bad.

It is a buyer for Cracker barrel who will bring us

into the gift shops at Cracker barrel.

Ooh, love that.

I love first off,

Sarah, how specific it is because you're going to be able

to know,

yes, no,

this is happening or it isn't.

Right. Love it.

Love it.

Okay. We're putting it out into the universe.

This is a law of attraction.

Question in disguise.

Yeah. If anybody knows someone in Cracker barrel,

we're ready.

We're ready for you right Then.

And how can people connect with you online because they know

somebody at Cracker barrel,

they need to get in touch with you.

How are they going to do that?

The best way is probably email,

which is,

I'm sure you'll,

you'll link to it here in the podcast,

but it's Sarah with an h@southerncaramel.com

Wonderful. And that will be on the show notes page as

well as your website,

social media links,

et cetera.

So give biz listeners,

you know that you can always go there and resource for

every show and this is no different.

And your website is Southern caramel.com

correct? That is correct.

Wonderful. Well thank you so,

so much Sarah.

This has been absolutely fabulous.

As I was just mentioning a second ago,

just watching your journey scene where you are seeing how much

you've progressed is fabulous and your product is spectacular.

So I wish you continued success.

Oh, I think so much.

So I really appreciate your time today.

I really enjoyed this discussion with Sarah and the two big

lessons that we covered.

First, that initial problems with your product can lead to identifying

even more potential.

So if this happens to you,

adjust your product,

don't give up on your big goal.

Second is the opportunity.

Sarah dives into with local shows in the season.

There are craft shows and bazaars all around.

No matter where you live.

Take advantage of this and if you've never done one before,

I challenge you to jump in because if not now when

up next week we're switching gears.

We're talking to a maker who has a business like no

other. I know you're going to enjoy hearing her story and

it might just spark some brand new ideas for you,

a product we've never covered here before and a journey to

get her there like no other tune in next Monday to

hear what it's all about and until then make it a

great week.

Bye for now.

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how to fix them.

You'll learn from Sue and owners just like you who are

seeing real growth and are living their dream maker to master

find and fix what's not working in your small business.